ISIS terror attacks around the world

You forget that these bad people are humans just like you and me, they have been under educated from an early age so it is difficult to change their view of the world. Those people exist in every society, it just happens that there are more of them in middle east right now because the middle east is made of developing countries that still lack the education level of the developed world. I also feel that you are assuming that these people had the same conditions and resources that you had, which is false. These individuals should not be compared with us as they have seen life in a completely different view and may not even have access to a perspective that differs from their own, unlike what we are doing right now with this discussion. This means that their ideas and view on life will be reinforced by the people around them, depriving them from the chance to form more educated opinions and the chance to develop critical thinking.

In addition, like I mentioned before, although I agree with Europe's stance on immigration, I do not like how they handled it. A lot of bad people were allowed in easily.

Also, I am not saying that the entire blame is on the developed world, I mentioned from my first post that both sides are to blame. A lot of good muslims are trying to ignore the problems because they want to escape them or they have given up. There are muslims that are trying to make a change but it is difficult to convince people to believe in it when they have spent most, if not all, their lives seeing their countries in terrible conditions.

"The norm"

http://d35brb9zkkbdsd.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/terrorism-EU-2-638x599.png

M99 wrote:"The norm"

http://d35brb9zkkbdsd.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/terrorism-EU-2-638x599.png

I see you still didn't read what I said about the norm. and we both know 100% that chart is bullshit. but I will bite. in the last 5 years what in your opinion has the terror attacks been about

•MilanDevil• wrote:You forget that these bad people are humans just like you and me, they have been under educated from an early age so it is difficult to change their view of the world. Those people exist in every society, it just happens that there are more of them in middle east right now because the middle east is made of developing countries that still lack the education level of the developed world. I also feel that you are assuming that these people had the same conditions and resources that you had, which is false. These individuals should not be compared with us as they have seen life in a completely different view and may not even have access to a perspective that differs from their own, unlike what we are doing right now with this discussion. This means that their ideas and view on life will be reinforced by the people around them, depriving them from the chance to form more educated opinions and the chance to develop critical thinking.

In addition, like I mentioned before, although I agree with Europe's stance on immigration, I do not like how they handled it. A lot of bad people were allowed in easily.

Also, I am not saying that the entire blame is on the developed world, I mentioned from my first post that both sides are to blame. A lot of good muslims are trying to ignore the problems because they want to escape them or they have given up. There are muslims that are trying to make a change but it is difficult to convince people to believe in it when they have spent most, if not all, their lives seeing their countries in terrible conditions.

your point don't make sense mate. a lot of the people that are doing these things are born or grew up in places like Belgium france and London. so you cant blame it on them having a shit life. people can say what they like but the fact is this. if islam was not in Europe then these attacks would never have happened. and that is a fact. islam is a major problem in the world today. people can say its not all of them all day long. and I agree its not all of them. but its enough of them to change the face of the earth.

Its going to take more than one or two generations for people to change their views. A similar thing happened when some Italian families emigrated to the United States. At some point, you have to realize that it has nothing to do with religion. Like I mentioned, it is normal for humans to shift responsibility elsewhere as it helps justify one's actions.

Unique wrote:

M99 wrote:"The norm"

http://d35brb9zkkbdsd.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/terrorism-EU-2-638x599.png

I see you still didn't read what I said about the norm. and we both know 100% that chart is bullshit. but I will bite. in the last 5 years what in your opinion has the terror attacks been about

If I could trade your [insult deleted - 25% - rwo] body for just 1 of the victims in Belgium I would, in a flash.

sportsczy wrote:This has absolutely nothing to do about culture or religion.  It's all about hopelessness caused by high unemployment and people who are criminals.  These are the two main target groups of these radicals.

Granted, radicalisation is an epidemic in the prison system. But, unemployment? You really saying mass murder is about unemployment?

That crude link that crime=poverty has so many counter examples it isn't likely to be some sort of crucial factor that motivates a person to go on a murder spree.

I'll give you an example from 1930s England. Unemployment was worse in the north, downright lawlessness was worse in the south, whatever factors are involved, unemployment just ain't the decider. Here's an excerpt from a study: "The ordinary unemployed man does not drift into crime; he has generations of moral principle behind him and stands with his back to the wall fighting the demoralising influence of enforced idleness year after year without resorting to crime"

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Lawbreaker-Critical-Modern-Treatment-Routledge-Revivals/dp/1138999849/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1458727104&sr=1-1


You realise also there are a lot of highly educated men with engineering backgrounds in the terrorism business?

Unique wrote:in the last 5 years what in your opinion has the terror attacks been about

Well, when I look at my home town and close surrounding, then the most terror was caused by either motorbike gangs (Bandidos vs Hells Angels) or the Mafia ('Ndrangheta, to be precise), both of which caused shootings only a street away from a former workplace of mine and on the parking lot of my main shopping center here. As I looked up crime stuff for some other discussion, I was very surprised to read that half (!) of the crime acts committed in Germany were in fact Mafia related. As for Islamist terror, at least here there was none so far.

Unique wrote:

McLewis wrote:My thoughts and support go out to the families of the victims. Terrible event and completely reprehensible.

What I see hasn't been talked about is the same thing I didn't really see getting talked about in the wake of the Paris attacks: the disenfranchised minorities within these countries. That's where ISIS are getting their manpower for stuff like this. These immigrant populations within cities like Brussels clearly don't trust the police force to protect and serve them just as a large number of blacks here in America don't. They feel marginalized, discriminated against by the native populations, especially when you have far right figures like Marine Le Pen going on about them. This is what causes them to resist integrating into the culture of their new country and to stick to the customs native to them. For many of these folks from the Middle East or Northern Africa, which Islam is pre-dominant, that gives ISIS nearly ready made reserves from which they can draw more and more manpower, simply be tapping into that anger and resentment at being disenfranchised. I think that's what was at play in this attack just as it was in the Paris attacks. Belgium must do a better job of resolving that problem by community outreach with these groups. As should France and all other countries facing an influx in refugees. Doing this makes it harder for ISIS to subvert and convert the really vulnerable ones like these 3 guys who carried out this attack.

we welcomed islam into Europe. we give them a home. we welcome mulims from war torn countries. we do our best to make them feel at home. and we get this shit. and your saying all this shit is down to them not trusting the police. they do it because we are infidels. they are brain washed crack pots that want to kill in the name of a imaginary friend.

It's more than not trusting the police, that's the most tangible element. They don't trust anyone outside of their own communities to really care about what they have to go through. They don't trust local, regional or state government to represent their best interests, to ensure that they have the same rights and path to prosperity as the native population in their country. It's very "Us vs Them" even when it's acknowledged that they've been taken in from their war-torn homelands. There's a real duality to this situation that, for me at least, serves as the undercurrent to why these attacks keep happening.

If these folks were better off financially by way of having good-paying jobs that provide the prosperity and stability that so many of them want, do you really think ISIS would have such an easy time subverting them to their cause? I personally don't think so. When you are disenfranchised, it's a depression. You feel lost. You feel like no one cares and when that happens long enough, you'll follow just about anyone and do just about anything for someone who decides to care....even if it's a terrorist organization hellbent on mayhem. And yet, if you have stability, if you have prosperity, especially in a new country, you are more likely to embrace the new culture around you. I see it all the time here in my country. People come here, embrace what it is to be American, work hard and they see the benefits. This transcends race, religion and ideology. And in doing so they become true Americans. The same can happen in many of these European countries, but they have to do a better job of actually doing meaningful community outreach and showing that they care more about the people they've taken in than the concept or idea of accepting refugees as there's a big difference in the two. What you're basically saying regarding these refugees is akin to a foster parent taking in a bunch of orphans and then treating them like absolute crap, but then hiding behind that by saying "I gave them a home, they should be grateful". And then you wonder why they don't embrace your culture, they stick to their and then eventually become indoctrinated.

I am not a religious person, but I can tell you that despite what ISIS keep jawing on about....this isn't about religion. It never has been. Islam is the excuse being used to purport terror. I really don't believe these guys believe in the same morals, values and beliefs that everyday muslims believe in. If that were true, we'd have billions of terrorists instead of just a few thousand. They hi-jacked a religion just as some tyrants of the past have hi-jacked an ideology to suit their needs. ISIS doesn't care about Islam. It cares about killing people to spread fear. If you can't see that then I really don't know what else to tell you. It's not as black and white as you make it. Dealing in absolutes on this topic simply doesn't work.

@mclewis, u nailed it

McLewis

LeVersacci wrote:

Unique wrote:

M99 wrote:"The norm"

http://d35brb9zkkbdsd.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/terrorism-EU-2-638x599.png

I see you still didn't read what I said about the norm. and we both know 100% that chart is bullshit. but I will bite. in the last 5 years what in your opinion has the terror attacks been about

If I could trade your [insult deleted - rwo] body for just 1 of the victims in Belgium I would, in a flash.

and I would pay £500 to stand next to you when you keep calling me [insult deleted - no need to repeat it all over - rwo]

rwo power wrote:

Unique wrote:in the last 5 years what in your opinion has the terror attacks been about

Well, when I look at my home town and close surrounding, then the most terror was caused by either motorbike gangs (Bandidos vs Hells Angels) or the Mafia ('Ndrangheta, to be precise), both of which caused shootings only a street away from a former workplace of mine and on the parking lot of my main shopping center here. As I looked up crime stuff for some other discussion, I was very surprised to read that half (!) of the crime acts committed in Germany were in fact Mafia related. As for Islamist terror, at least here there was none so far.

but motorbike gangs are not flying planes into buildings are they.

Unique wrote:

LeVersacci wrote:

Unique wrote:
I see you still didn't read what I said about the norm. and we both know 100% that chart is bullshit. but I will bite. in the last 5 years what in your opinion has the terror attacks been about

If I could trade your [insult deleted - rwo] body for just 1 of the victims in Belgium I would, in a flash.

and I would pay £500 to stand next to you when you keep calling me [insult deleted - rwo]

Isn't £500 what you roughly get from the government [insult deleted, and if you do that again, you'll lose another 25% - rwo]? Would be a shame to waste it just to stand next to me (:

I listened to a funny analogy recently by someone caricaturing how some people keep reacting to this terrorism

If a new neighbour moves in next door and you forget to bring them a welcome basket, it's totally understandable if your new neighbour comes over to blow your house up.

Insane, but yet so aptly demonstrated by Mclewis's logic. It's like the standard criminal=victim/karmic retribution paradigm, on hallucinogens . Completely through the looking glass.

LeVersacci wrote:

Unique wrote:

LeVersacci wrote:
If I could trade your [insult deleted - rwo] body for just 1 of the victims in Belgium I would, in a flash.

and I would pay £500 to stand next to you when you keep calling me [insult deleted - rwo]

Isn't £500 what you roughly get from the government [insult deleted - rwo] ? Would be a shame to waste it just to stand next to me (:

in England you get more than £500 off the government that's why starving people travel across Europe to get here

Turns out it was 2 brothers that blew them selfs up.

Unique wrote: but motorbike gangs are not flying planes into buildings are they.

Shooting around in a parking lot of a well-visited shopping center does strike some terror in passers-by, too. Especially when those motorbike gang patrol around in the streets, even when they don't do anything yet.

Oh, and don't let me start about those East European crime syndicates that run rampant in many cities with burglaries and robberies...

Obviously Unique has no reply to Mclewis's wonderful post.

rwo power wrote:

Unique wrote: but motorbike gangs are not flying planes into buildings are they.

Shooting around in a parking lot of a well-visited shopping center does strike some terror in passers-by, too. Especially when those motorbike gang patrol around in the streets, even when they don't do anything yet.

Oh, and don't let me start about those East European crime syndicates that run rampant in many cities with burglaries and robberies...

why don't the police arrest the bikers. From what your saying they wouldn't be hard to find

M99 wrote:Obviously Unique has no reply to Mclewis's wonderful post.

I disagree with him. No point saying that twice. Imo the world would be a much better place if we got rid of religion.

Well, they can only arrest them if they actually catch them - and often they just manage to drive around threateningly, which is no crime in itself.

[mod]Oh, by the way - if someone insults people, prepare to get 25% docked. And for the people who get insulted - please don't repeat the insult in replies, it just makes it more tedious for me or other mods to clean up stuff -_-[/mod]

rwo power wrote:Well, they can only arrest them if they actually catch them - and often they just manage to drive around threateningly, which is no crime in itself.

we have lots of crime in London but for some reason we have not had any motorbike gangs. Well none that makes the news anyway.

That tends to happen when you have the most CCTV out of all the cities in the world

Like i said, i don't mind it much, i mean just read the BBC report on the Brussels attack: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-35869985

How did they manage to sneak a gun in the check-in area? Let alone the bombs, it seems there's a lack of security.

Like i said before, i don't mind giving up some privacy, heck in London there's a CCTV in about every nook and cranny, every street, every corner, etc. For the safety of the people, it seems like a small price to pay, at least to me

ES wrote:That tends to happen when you have the most CCTV out of all the cities in the world

Like i said, i don't mind it much, i mean just read the BBC report on the Brussels attack: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-35869985

How did they manage to sneak a gun in the check-in area? Let alone the bombs, it seems there's a lack of security.

Like i said before, i don't mind giving up some privacy, heck in London there's a CCTV in about every nook and cranny, every street, every corner, etc. For the safety of the people, it seems like a small price to pay, at least to me

the problem the security have is the fall out if they get it wrong. Had they pulled the men in and stopped the attacks they would be heros. But if they pulled over 2 Arab looking men and searched them and found nothing they would get called racist. And people would say your racist profiling. So it's hard for them to do the job.