Anyone in favour of selling Suarez?

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Post by BenHarrison Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:40 pm

Hey folks,

Reasonably new poster on the boards, and not a Liverpool fan. Apologies if there is already a topic for this, but I was wondering how many fans are actually up for selling Suarez and reinvesting the cash elsewhere - for example in several new prospects like Coutinho and others?

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Post by Nishankly Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:51 pm

Welcome to the forum Ben!

I am all against keeping unwanted players at the club, Suarez's preferred destination was always Real or Barca, So a part of him still has to decide whether he stays with Liverpool or "settles" with Arsenal probably to leave them within a few years to move to Spain.

If he does stay and his attitude towards us and the ambition of the club doesnt change or he plays in the red jersey with a smile, Ill be happy to see him play for us.

If we sell him , You can look at Napoli, Sold Cavani and bought Higuain, Mertens, Raul Albiol, Reina etc, Their net spend is still in the negative with these four players. We on the other hand dont have Europe so these types of players would be hard to come by. The list of players that want to join us is thin.

Everything is speculation for now, Arsenal dont seem to be keen on forking out 50 million and Liverpool dont seem to be keen on selling to the team which is the weakest in the "top 4". I can see Suarez as a LFC player next season unless he puts in a transfer request.
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Post by McAgger Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:57 pm

I really don't know if we can find suitable replacements this late in the window without CL football. If he gives us his all for one more season, his value will definitely remain the same, and we can actually have 1 full year to look for a desirable replacement, maybe even offer Cl football (who knows).

But if he continuous to push out of the team and sulk then I will be the first to admit that I don't want him anywhere near LFC. Send him outside of England, doesn't matter where just outside of England. Preferably Anzhi.
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Post by BenHarrison Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:59 pm

Interesting - I too can envisage him staying on if the right move isn't there for him. I guess Benteke was in a similar, albeit less high profile, situation at Villa.

I saw some crazy, and obviously not fully reflective of the true picture, stats re. Suarez and Liverpool at Opta the other day.

1. Without Luis Suarez's goals last season, Liverpool would still have finished seventh in the Premier League table.

2. With Suarez Liverpool had a win % of 39, without him 62% (albeit based on fewer games)

Shows while he might be top quality, he probably isn't indispensable.

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Post by Nishankly Mon Jul 29, 2013 6:02 pm

Well if Suarez does go, We do lose 30 goals but our replacements will probably get us enough goals i have faith in the scouting team they were able to find gems like Coutinho and Sturridge Proud

Which team do you support Ben?
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Post by BenHarrison Mon Jul 29, 2013 6:11 pm

I'm a Newcastle fan mate, more is the pity. The club never ceases to disappoint, and JFK returning this summer is just the latest example.

I just love football though, so always keen to find out how other clubs' fans are getting on and have craic about the issues.

Suarez is just one of a few stories that have made this a fantastic summer for transfer news and gossip - Moyes, Mourinho etc. too.

Inspired by this, me and a few mates have just started a new footy website aiming to provide articles that counter conventional wisdom in the BPL - it's better than the day job!

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Post by BenHarrison Mon Jul 29, 2013 6:16 pm

Re. direct replacement - It's also interesting that despite Arsenal losing RVP last season and not replacing him like for like, they scored only three goals fewer last season than when they had him.

Bringing in Podolski and Giroud, who each got into double figures, gave the Gunners more tactical flexibility, and a similar number of goals.

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Post by BenHarrison Mon Jul 29, 2013 6:21 pm

McAgger wrote:I really don't know if we can find suitable replacements this late in the window without CL football. If he gives us his all for one more season, his value will definitely remain the same, and we can actually have 1 full year to look for a desirable replacement, maybe even offer Cl football (who knows).

But if he continuous to push out of the team and sulk then I will be the first to admit that I don't want him anywhere near LFC. Send him outside of England, doesn't matter where just outside of England. Preferably Anzhi.

Yeah I guess it's the thought of him lining up against you next season for a rival that is impossible to tolerate. It's surprising that other teams globally haven't chosen to test Liverpool's resolve given the situation.

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Post by Art Morte Mon Jul 29, 2013 6:56 pm

For £50m, yeah, I'd rather sell than keep him. He's not exactly likeable, you know.
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Post by stevieg8 Mon Jul 29, 2013 7:37 pm

Short of a transfer request or an absurdly large bid, I'd rather keep him than not. He's a known quantity, and that quantity is pretty damn good. Replacing him, even with 50m, would be difficult without CL footy. Even if we get our targets, there's the risk that some or all of them won't work out. Unless he's not going to be playing with full effort, I say we keep him for at least one more year - and I don't see that happening ever with Suarez, let alone in a WC year. He loves the game too much, even if he can be a bit of a twat sometimes.
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Post by Red Alert Tue Jul 30, 2013 5:51 am

He hasn't been pushing out for a move ffs. Stop stating it as a fact. It's not true.

The media is making everything up and they're all getting into your heads. You all seemed to agree with Red before the start or just when the window opened that the media will do anything they can to unsettle him and agreeing it would all be bollocks.

He has not once said he will leave for Arsenal yet half of you are worried about him moving there all because they made a bid. The media goes on about him wanting CL and stating it as a fact when he's never said so; they're assuming he does and then you guys (and the rest of the public) think there's a quote going around stating he wants CL football and that's why he's "pushing" for a move. There is no quote. Again. If he is to leave Liverpool, he will leave England. And the only club that he would honestly "push" a move for is for Madrid.  Madrid seem to be persistent in wanting Bale. Which only works in our favour because we can now demand a stupid fee like 60-70m if they come in for him late. We'll mostly reject that though, because there is no way we'll make CL football without Luis Suarez next season.
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Post by Red Alert Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:05 am

Also, Suarez has only said it would be hard to say no to Madrid. Which majority of players ALL AROUND the world have said in the past. Vidal was another player that was a victim by Marca saying he was pushing for a move to Madrid (just this summer.)

Gerrard also said a very familiar thing to Chelsea in 05. Let it play out before you label him as a "c*nt" and all this other nonsense going around.
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Post by TheRedStag Wed Jul 31, 2013 1:22 am

Sell him for ta *bleep* for big money. He's annoyed me enough at this stage.
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Post by Adit Wed Jul 31, 2013 7:31 am

Kike Marin** ‏@Kike_Marin_ 6m
Me cuentan que Pere Guardiola, agente de Luis Suárez, tiene previsto marcharse a vivir a Londres. Luis, también... Quiere irse al Arsenal

"Pere Guardiola, Luis Suarez agent, wants to live in London. Luis, too ... He wants to go to Arsenal."


....................
Obviously Arsenal made the bid after consulting Luiz suarez's agent Suarez probably said yes to Arsenal, there is no other reason for Arsenal to bid for Suarez if the player isnt willing to move to them.
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Post by Fahim89 Wed Jul 31, 2013 7:52 am

Times & Guardian have both come out to report that according to the contract LFC are under no obligation to sell Suarez @ any price below their desired value. Mirror I guess followed this up by saying that as the contract are pretty solid Suarez won't take this to court. Telegraph (most likely) report that LFC have made it clear to Arsenal that they won't sell to them.

Sorry guys can't post the links as I'm out & accessing through. phone. Will do so as soon as I can
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Post by RedOranje Wed Jul 31, 2013 8:02 am

The only ones that really matter are the (mostly) reliable sources, and Chris Bascombe qualifies as that in the current crop of reports (though even then he's been wrong in the past, so don't take it as gospel).

Bascombe wrote: Suárez has made no representation to the Premier League to seek adjudication on whether Arsenal’s provocative bid of one pound over £40 million obliged Liverpool to sell.

Arsenal believed their offer, submitted last week, would trigger an exit clause in the Uruguayan’s contract, a suggestion the Anfield board rejected instantly.

Liverpool are unmoved by any suggestion there is any ambiguity and are adamant if the Premier League was to adjudicate on any dispute the club’s position would be validated further.

The lack of any approach does not suggest confidence on the part of the striker’s advisers. Club lawyers and those of Fenway Sports Group are definite about the details of Suárez’s contract and believe the 26-year-old’s agent, Pere Guardiola, is well aware Arsenal’s £40 million bid was far too low.

“We’ve all examined the clause in detail,” a senior Liverpool figure said. “All it obliges is for us to enter good faith negotiations about Luis’s future. There is absolutely no obligation to sell and that is very clear.”

Liverpool themselves could request the Premier League to ask Arsenal on what basis they bid £40,000,001. It is contrary to League regulations for a rival club to be given access to confidential contract details of an opposing player. There are no Liverpool plans at this stage to pursue a complaint against the Londoners, although at the highest level of the Merseyside club there is a feeling bidding an additional pound was "rubbing Liverpool’s noses in it".

It [the £40m + 1 bid] has ensured no further approaches by Arsenal are welcome at Anfield.

Liverpool, meanwhile, have agreed a loan deal for Benfica left back Lorenzo Melgarejo but will require a work permit if they are to proceed with signing of the Paraguay international.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/liverpool/10212420/Luis-Suarez-unmoved-by-Arsenals-provocative-bid-for-Liverpool-striker-as-Uruguayans-exit-clause-not-triggered.html
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Post by Fahim89 Wed Jul 31, 2013 10:32 am

@Red: Thanks was finding it hard to track the article again. Was basically talking more about this Bascombe link.
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Post by stevieg8 Wed Jul 31, 2013 2:08 pm

I also read yesterday that Liverpool could press an inquiry against Arsenal if they wanted to over the strange nature of the bid, as release clauses are supposed to be confidential. If Arsenal had received the information from an unacceptable source (such as Guardiola), rather than just the rumor mills, they could be fined for making such a specific bid on the basis of illegal information. Not saying we should do it, but it's interesting.

@Adit: Is it not plausible in your mind that they made the bid hoping Liverpool would accept, and they'd get to talk to Suarez afterwards, like in every other transfer ever? I don't think they necessarily got any confirmation from Suarez about his interest yet. Not that it really matters if he's interested, they're still gonna say no unless a ridiculous bid comes in.
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Post by Red Alert Wed Jul 31, 2013 3:02 pm

What does Suarez AGENT wanting to live in London got to do with anything ffs?

No ones forcing him to live in Liverpool (if he does). He sure in hell doesn't live with Suarez. Should Pep Guardiola leave Bayern to join a London based club because his brother (the agent that represents both Luis and Pep) wants to live in London?
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Post by Red Alert Wed Jul 31, 2013 3:15 pm

Might as well make this the Luis Suarez thread.

Rodgers:


"It's a story that can keep running but for me there is no new news," Rodgers told the Liverpool Echo.

"Luis is happy. He totally understands the club's point of view. He's in a difficult position in terms of not being able to play because of his suspension - he will sit out the first six games and he will miss playing football."

Suarez is currently four games into a 10-match ban for biting Chelsea defender Branislav Ivanovic during a Premier League clash on 21 April.

And while Rodgers suggests the time on the sidelines and the transfer speculation could have a detrimental impact on his player's preparation for the season, he insists Suarez is remaining positive and is ready for the new season.

"He's working hard and remains part of the group. He hasn't been moping about," he continued. "It's obviously difficult when you come back after a break but he has settled in and has been working well.

"He needs to get up to speed and we will continue to work to get all the players ready for the first game of the season."
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Post by vegfootball Fri Aug 02, 2013 6:58 am

i know go against the what Liverpool fans think of Suárez,

how i saw Dalglish (2nd term) here i was think with his Transfers a throw back not Dalglish 80's team but Liverpool team from 70's Toshack & Keegan, then Heighway &  Callaghan out wide,

it look like we had are Toshack & Keegan in Carroll & Suarez, are Heighway but did get are Callaghan, in my opinion Suarez did half as good job as Keegan work with Dalglish for 1 & half year, to much with head down & not look up,

Rodgers took over & again this my opinion Suarez look in open 8 games or so half good player, then step up big time after that,

so this how see it with Suárez as  Liverpool player out 77 games he had i would say around 38 games were a top player, 19 games or so a good player, 20 games not so good

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formation i have all ways see Suárez best position as a withdrawn strike play of centre forward in a free role, with Dalglish set up it was fit for Suárez, as for Rodgers he like to play one loan forward, what i don't fit Suárez nor out wide

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Suárez as person, he come arcoss as mad, his bad boy time in Dutch football, let down  Dalglish & let the club down two with his ban's, now this talk of he what join " bigger club" hang on Suárez yes Liverpool have not won the  League in 20+ years but we are still in top 3 clubs in England to win the most Honours
in that time ( p.s Arsenal have not won a thing for what 8 years, em were League Cup was not far back)

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Liverpool F.C made Suárez the player he is & we make word class, Suárez did not make Liverpool F.C, we sold better & gone on to good times
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Post by Red Alert Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:05 am


I think I'm the only one on this forum (and well, an 'outlier' in terms of fans around the world) that want Luis Suarez to stay and want him to continue to let him play in the first team. Luis Suarez has done himself no favours in his latest interview, in fact it's pretty stupid of what he has done. There's no denying that. He's put a lot of pressure on Liverpool Football Club. He really should be fined for his comments and we should get the "leadership" at the club have a little chat with him to help control himself in regards to pushing for a move. (I still don't think he wants Arsenal or he wouldn't be talking to the media considering Arsenal are the only ones that seem interested at the moment.)

I've seen a lot of comments going around suggesting that we should let him rot in the reserves. But that just makes things worst. Firstly, it doesn't the youth a chance to impress the manager. How would we see the likes of Yesil and Teixeira, and other talents from the reserves progress and improve if we're keeping a (some what stupid player "world class") grounded. Secondly, his price is only going to go down when we eventually sell him in the future. Thirdly, we don't have the finances to let him play in the reserves. Our finances are healthy, but they're not THAT good.

There's also no denying what he gives to the club on the pitch. He is after all, our best player in the final third. He is pretty much our playmaker, and our 20+ goal scorer. He is truly one of the most complete forwards in the world at the moment. How exactly do we replace that in our current position? We can't. So why not use him, and do what's best for the club? We're going to be in the same old rut we've been in recent years if we don't make CL. Luis Suarez is pretty much the best possible chance we have today of getting that. And that's not putting him infront of the club, far from it really. I think people forget Luis Suarez is under contract AT Liverpool, it's not the other way around. He can try and take the whole contract thing to court, but he won't win. At the end of the day, his signature is on the contract with no buy-out clause.

People are going on about him being a mercenary, which is true in a way, but does that really matter? "Mercenary's" are the reason majority of players have joined our club (and around clubs all around the world) in the past and in the present. It's why majority players want to play in the CL. Not only because of the competition, but because the best teams in the world are in the competition. At the end of the day, the footballing world is made up of "mercenarys", so there's no need to be bitter when the inevitable does happen and Luis does leave, although his words do hurt.

I think everyone deep down knew we were going to lose Luis Suarez in the future if we weren't to make the champions league. And at the end of the day, that day has come. It's just like how majority of the 'world class' mercenarys we've had in the past have done. The likes of Mascherano, Torres and to an extent, how Alonso left. They didn't really put themselves infront of the club, they were just looking after their careers from a personal view. You have to remember, 'foreign' players abroad don't normally have a mutual relationship to the club. They only want to win things and be remembered for in the future. Torres is a *bleep* for the way he left, and whilst he does regret moving to Chelsea the way he did (his wife has said so) do you think he cares about being labelled a "flop" now? He's won more than 5 trophies at Chelsea, one of them being the Champions League. Was it a bad career move for him?

The things that gets me is that Suarez continuously states that the club promised him he was to be sold this window and that the club always knew what he wants; so why have we not replaced him earlier? Torres has also said the same thing in the past. Which just means the whole board should also be blamed. Fair enough if Arsenal haven't met the valuation of the player, but is there anything to suggest we're in for a replacement after Rodgers has continuosly said in the past weeks that we only want to bring 2 players at the club and Luis is staying? Whole things a mess. Honestly, no hard feelings if he does go to Madrid, but I think we should keep him at the club.

Excuse typos / not making sense, didn't exactly re read it lol.
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Post by RedOranje Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:08 am

"The things that gets me is that Suarez continuously states that the club promised him he was to be sold this window and that the club always knew what he wants"


Go check his quotes from January.

The club clearly didn't know he was going to demand an exit when they were planning for this window because HE clearly hadn't decided that yet... nevermind last summer when his new contract was actually written up.
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Post by Red Alert Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:13 am

His quotes in January stating he's happy and would love to stay? Yeah, I've heard them.

If the board PROMISED a move does he really have to demand an exit? And why are they promising him an exit anyway?
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Post by Red Alert Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:16 am

Also, ever since his first interview saying "it will be hard to say no to Madrid" he continuously stated that Liverpool knew the situation of what was going on the whole time.

Don't get me wrong, Suarez is definitely in the wrong to get his way. But the club is also at fault here. Torres stated the same thing before he left as well.
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