Can Religious Republic countries considered as true democratic countries?

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Can Religious Republic countries considered as true democratic countries? Empty Can Religious Republic countries considered as true democratic countries?

Post by Adit Sat Sep 15, 2012 3:10 am

Countries like Pakistan etc are religious republic . Can they be considered as true democratic countries when they ignore their minority populations and portray their entire population as Islamic republic?
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Post by Zero Sat Sep 15, 2012 3:19 am

Pakistan is a theocracy? I thought it's a federal state?

By the way, as long as the government treats their citizens rights and gives all the benefits they rightfully deserve then it's a democratic state.

But if they don't and they oppress the minority then it's just a measly democratic country by name (i.e North Korea, Sri Lanka, etc) and not in practice.


Last edited by Zero on Sat Sep 15, 2012 3:23 am; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : accident)
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Post by VivaStPauli Sat Sep 15, 2012 5:05 am

Adit wrote:Countries like Pakistan etc are religious republic . Can they be considered as true democratic countries when they ignore their minority populations and portray their entire population as Islamic republic?

Can Religious Republic countries considered as true democratic countries? N50385bae6de3c

(Besides the fact that the elections in those countries are mostly rigged anyway.)
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Post by TalkingReckless Sat Sep 15, 2012 11:12 am

lol we aren't a democracy, our elections were rigged, they recently had to make alot of changes in the election process because much of it had fake things and there is no way of finding out

Zardari asked US to make a deal to wipe off all his corruption cases (100s of million) with Musharraf and he accepted and he openly says it. Right now we have are on the verge of losing our 2nd PM this year because he won't sign a paper opening up a Swiss corruption case of Millions against Zardari, so the Judiciary is sacking the PM and a new one is coming in again.

and btw we were never a Islamic Republic until a Military dictator took charge by executing Bhutto's Father. There was no mention of the word Islam in our Constitution before the 70s.
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Post by Yuri Yukuv Mon Sep 17, 2012 2:54 am

Pakistan is probably the closest thing to hell on earth after afghanistan
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Post by BeautifulGame Mon Sep 17, 2012 12:17 pm

I dont even think Pakistanis consider their country a democracy. Laughing

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Post by TalkingReckless Mon Sep 17, 2012 4:53 pm

BeautifulGame wrote:I dont even think Pakistanis consider their country a democracy. Laughing


Even though our Current President is scum of the worst kind, the majority of the nation wants him to finish his term and not be kicked out before that, so he doesn't have an excuse later and use that as an advantage, it will probably be the first time anyone has finished their term in Pakistan...

Btw as much as India likes to say they are a Democracy they too have their own Family parties like Gandhis/Nehru's, The INC is an family party..
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Post by BeautifulGame Mon Sep 17, 2012 9:17 pm

Legend wrote:
BeautifulGame wrote:I dont even think Pakistanis consider their country a democracy. Laughing


Even though our Current President is scum of the worst kind, the majority of the nation wants him to finish his term and not be kicked out before that, so he doesn't have an excuse later and use that as an advantage, it will probably be the first time anyone has finished their term in Pakistan...



Not probably.Certainly the first any democratically elected party in Pakistan finishes its term.Just shows how awfully unstable and immature their democracy.And their recent clashes with the supreme courts is another prime example of that as well.


Btw as much as India likes to say they are a Democracy they too have their own Family parties like Gandhis/Nehru's, The INC is an family party..

The biggest strength in our democracy is mainly through regional democracy though.

Even if INC is a family party they are still democratically elected when it comes to elections.Yes our democracy isnt best or perfect one but it definitely is reasonably working for us and thats the most important thing imo.


Last edited by BeautifulGame on Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:33 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Post by RedOranje Mon Sep 17, 2012 9:42 pm

Democracies are by definition ruled by the majority. A true majority will always neglect the minorities to some extent.
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Post by Eivindo Sat Mar 09, 2013 9:00 pm

Are there any real democracies? hmm
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Post by Cruijf Sun Mar 10, 2013 11:51 pm

Eivindo wrote:Are there any real democracies? hmm

Well that's actually a funny point, because a 'real' democracy would be an absolute disaster. The democracy we know and practice in the West is democracy that's not applied completely.

But back to the point, there aren't any democracies in the Middle East, but that's not because they're religious republics. A democratic religious republic is not impossible.
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Post by BarrileteCosmico Mon Mar 11, 2013 6:24 am

RedOranje wrote:Democracies are by definition ruled by the majority. A true majority will always neglect the minorities to some extent.
The case made for populism, CheOrange :bow:
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Post by VivaStPauli Mon Mar 11, 2013 6:59 am

ACMRox wrote:
Well that's actually a funny point, because a 'real' democracy would be an absolute disaster. The democracy we know and practice in the West is democracy that's not applied completely.

No it isn't. Representation is well established as a cornerstone of a democracy. Just because a word-for-word translation of the term implies a kind of mob rule, it still doesn't mean that. Read up on your Aristotele.

A democratic religious republic is not impossible.
It technically isn't, but it would only work as long as all citizens voluntarily followed the same faith. If not, the "religiousness" of the democracy would be unrecognizable.


And @ RO - while that is true, there is still a huge difference between minor marginalization of some minorities and a forced conversion.
The problem of minority rights is well known and has been debated for centuries, a pretty good case was made by Alexis de Tocqueville.
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Post by Cruijf Mon Mar 11, 2013 4:04 pm

VivaStPauli wrote:
No it isn't. Representation is well established as a cornerstone of a democracy. Just because a word-for-word translation of the term implies a kind of mob rule, it still doesn't mean that. Read up on your Aristotele.

What you're thinking about is a representative democracy. A pure democracy was only really applied in Ancient Greece and it was more 'rule of the people' than 'representation of the people'.


It technically isn't, but it would only work as long as all citizens voluntarily followed the same faith. If not, the "religiousness" of the democracy would be unrecognizable.

Everyone following the same religion isn't a requirement of a religious republic
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Post by RedOranje Mon Mar 11, 2013 6:04 pm

Yes Viva, which is why I intentionally left my post as vague as possible... I was only attempting to make a point in the broadest sense and wanted to avoid creating an argument over semantics.
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Post by VivaStPauli Mon Mar 11, 2013 7:54 pm

So I was... Technically correct.
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Post by Bellabong Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:11 am

Real democracy a disaster? Switzerland?

@ACMRox if the religion in question is an Abrahamic religion then yes. It's the first commandment ffs.
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Post by Cruijf Sat Mar 16, 2013 2:41 pm

Phritz wrote:Real democracy a disaster? Switzerland?

Switzerland is probably the closest to a true democracy that we'll see in our lifetimes but it still has noticeable differences. It's definitely not a pure democracy.

@ACMRox if the religion in question is an Abrahamic religion then yes. It's the first commandment ffs.

lol nope. Speaking for Islam and Christianity (Judaism is slightly different) states where there are citizens who don't practice the religion in question do exist and can exist (theoretically and in practicality).
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Post by VivaStPauli Sat Mar 16, 2013 7:48 pm

Grassroots democracy isn't the only "pure democracy", a representative democracy is perfectly fine.

You can see it at work perfectly fine in all of Scandinavia, the Netherlands etc. etc. etc.
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Post by El Chelsea Fuerte Thu Jan 16, 2014 10:16 pm

Not really, especially when you have stuff like this happening.

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Post by El Chelsea Fuerte Fri Jan 24, 2014 8:41 pm

British man sentenced to death in Pakistani blasphemy case. Not the way I like to see democracy. Laughing

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Post by Nishankly Sun Feb 02, 2014 11:30 am

Not one day when there isnt a bomb blast in Pakistan Sad
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Post by Il Diavolo Thu Feb 06, 2014 1:55 am

I don't think you can look at Pakistan as a democracy per se. Yes, technically it is a democracy. But democracy, like any system, needs time to mature and grow. People understand the importance of their vote and politicians learn that they have to actually do something for the betterment of society to gain trust of the people, and this happens over time.

If you look at Pakistan though, over 32 of the 66 years it has existed for have been under military dictatorship. 2013 was the first time in the history of the country that a democratically elected government finished it's tenure. Not really a democracy if you ask me. At least not right now.

On the main issue in discussion, I am all for a secular government and I agree that religious republics can not be truly democratic. Reason being, there will always be people that do not belong to the majority religion, living in the country and those people will be discriminated against by the law itself. And since one of the most fundamental principles of any democracy is equal treatment of all people, it's not really a 'true' democracy.
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Post by Highburied Wed Mar 05, 2014 6:22 pm

Switzerland is perfect in human standards.

By, from and for the people.
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