Would you be indifferent to the benching of a club legend and captain after a small patch of poor form?

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Would you be indifferent to the benching of a club legend and captain after a small patch of poor form? Empty Would you be indifferent to the benching of a club legend and captain after a small patch of poor form?

Post by Le Samourai Fri Aug 10, 2012 10:52 pm

That's all I wanna know.


Last edited by Le Samourai on Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:29 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Post by izzy Fri Aug 10, 2012 10:54 pm

Suspect

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Post by the xcx Fri Aug 10, 2012 10:54 pm

I dont get the title, so cant answer.
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Post by The Franchise Fri Aug 10, 2012 10:56 pm

Yeah but, what is this really about? lol

And more importantly, can I move this to the Madrid section now? I assume this is about Madrid.
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Post by Rebaño Sagrado Fri Aug 10, 2012 10:56 pm

What's your agenda le Sam hmm
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Post by Le Samourai Fri Aug 10, 2012 10:57 pm

Nah it's for everyone, I wanna know if they would be open to their club openly treating legends in such a manner? It's a genuine question and completely open to everyone.
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Post by Lord Hades Fri Aug 10, 2012 10:59 pm

nah , i guess i would want him to get some leeway since he is a club legend , but if that form persists specially in the crucial half of the season, things have to be done for the betterment of the club
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Post by Guest Fri Aug 10, 2012 10:59 pm

Gerrard will be on our bench once Sahin comes in :coffee:

Spoiler:

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Post by the xcx Fri Aug 10, 2012 10:59 pm

Legend is only a status. Managers make decisions.
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Post by Pedram Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:01 pm

Schweini wrote:Gerrard will be on our bench once Sahin comes in :coffee:

Spoiler:

He can be your LB. :coffee:
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Post by RealGunner Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:02 pm

Would we bench Tony Adams after 2-3 poor games ? nope

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Post by The Franchise Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:02 pm

Well I think the answer if obvious.

Define "small patch of form".

If the guy is the captain, its for a reason, its more than just his ability. You dont bench him ever, unless he has permantly declined or unfit. Even then its not a done thing.

Puyol has declined and is often injured, however never will he be simply benched.

But im intrested, where are you going with this.
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Post by the xcx Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:03 pm

Im guessing he wants Iker benched?
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Post by Guest Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:04 pm

Pedram wrote:
Schweini wrote:Gerrard will be on our bench once Sahin comes in :coffee:

Spoiler:

He can be your LB. :coffee:

We already have the Brazilian Busquets, and the Welsh Iniesta. Only thing missing is the Turkish Xavi :coffee:

Livercelona Shocked

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Post by vivabarca38 Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:04 pm

Nameless wrote:Im guessing he wants Iker benched?
Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing rofl
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Post by RealGunner Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:04 pm

You mean Iniesta is the Welsh Allen hmm
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Post by Le Samourai Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:08 pm

I'm trying to gauge where the pursuit of doing everything even remotely possible to win ends and where respect for achieved status begins.

For example, when Ronaldo arrived Raul encountered a patch of poor form (mostly due to a complete change in role and function) . The coach coul've easily made the "rational decision" and benched Raul for Morientes , but it never happened and they eventually figured it out.

Would that be the right or wrong call?

Put trust in your guy who's given everything for you or do whatever you feel guarantees immediate results?

There are many other examples to be honest Barca faces a similar question with Mascherano and Puyol , Chelsea with Terry etc etc.

@Dani- Small patch of poor form? let's say 10 games. Actually, what would be your limit?


Last edited by Le Samourai on Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:19 pm; edited 4 times in total
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Post by Guest Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:08 pm

RealGunner wrote:You mean Iniesta is the WelshSpanish Allen hmm

Twisted Evil

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Post by The Franchise Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:12 pm

I think every situation is different. I cant talk about that with Raul, because I dont remember it clearly at all.

But to me, its simple. If he still has the quality and he can fit into the team then poor form is poor form and you stick with him. If he is actually declining and putting him in the team is to the detriment of the team, then he cant play.

To answer your question directly. Again, I dont remember it, but to me, sticking with Raul makes sense. But perhaps tactically, removing him could of been correct. Really, its impossible to answer without knowing all the details.
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Post by _LMG_10_ Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:15 pm

Le Samourai wrote:I'm trying to gauge where the pursuit of doing everything even remotely possible to win ends and where respect for achieved status begins.

For example, when Ronaldo arrived Raul encountered a huge patch of poor form (mostly due to a complete change in role and function) . The coach coul've easily made the "rational decision" and benched Raul for Morientes , but it never happened.

Would that be the right or wrong call?

Put trust in your guy who's given everything for you or do whatever you feel guarantees immediate results?

There are many other examples to be honest Barca faces a similar question with Mascherano and Puyol , Chelsea with Terry etc etc.

@Dani- Small patch of poor form? let's say 10 games. Actually, what would be your limit?

Depends on the personality of the captain.
Captains usually put the team ahead of themselves so they won't complain when they're benched so it won't affect morale negatively. They can still contribute from the bench.
What DOES affect morale negatively is when your team doesn't get a good result. I say bench the captain for the good of the team, if need be.

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Post by Le Samourai Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:24 pm

_LMG_10_ wrote:
Le Samourai wrote:I'm trying to gauge where the pursuit of doing everything even remotely possible to win ends and where respect for achieved status begins.

For example, when Ronaldo arrived Raul encountered a huge patch of poor form (mostly due to a complete change in role and function) . The coach coul've easily made the "rational decision" and benched Raul for Morientes , but it never happened.

Would that be the right or wrong call?

Put trust in your guy who's given everything for you or do whatever you feel guarantees immediate results?

There are many other examples to be honest Barca faces a similar question with Mascherano and Puyol , Chelsea with Terry etc etc.

@Dani- Small patch of poor form? let's say 10 games. Actually, what would be your limit?

Depends on the personality of the captain.
Captains usually put the team ahead of themselves so they won't complain when they're benched so it won't affect morale negatively. They can still contribute from the bench.
What DOES affect morale negatively is when your team doesn't get a good result. I say bench the captain for the good of the team, if need be.

Fair enough.

But there's a risk/reward factor here I mean if you bench a player especially someone old , there's no guarantee he ever returns to being the player he was again.

So you not only lose that leadership , but you also lose the chance that he'll actually return to form and be a formidable presence skill wise.

It's alot more difficult than moving parts fluidly in and out and expecting them to maintain or retain form the chances are always better if you stick with them.
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Post by Great Leader Sprucenuce Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:45 pm

This Allen is the Welsh Iniesta has to stop Laughing

Allen is a defensively superior more refined version of Henderson, if he's the Welsh of any Barca player it is Busquets.

Anyway as for the topic, if you have better options yes i would.

Going back a few years we had Kluivert and Bellamy who were starting to excel as a partnership and we were starting to climb the table as a result and then Shearer came back from Injury.

Kluivert was dropped despite it was obvious to everyone the best partnership we had was Kluivert-Bellamy and Kluivert eventually left and was always known as a flop because of this and Bellamy left soon after and we fell into mid-table obscurity.

Shearer is/was a legend but his interests shouldn't have been put ahead of the teams interests and we suffered as a result.

So basically if your legend is running through a poor run of form and you have better options i would drop him yes.
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Post by Guest Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:53 pm

a player joins Liverpool and Mole stops rating them :coffee:

Allen actually intercepts more balls compared to Tiote, and his key passes are very comparable to Cabaye. He is a hybrid of both :bow:

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Post by The Franchise Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:54 pm

Felt so sorry for Patrick when that happened to him, he deserved better. He wasnt in his prime at Newcastle but he still was ballin' pretty well before that.

I recall they tried to play him and Shearer at some points, but it of course never worked because at that stage, neither wanted to run in behind and both were fighting for the same crosses.

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Post by Onyx Sat Aug 11, 2012 12:04 am

Definitely. It's about having the best players. If the legend isn't good enough he should be benched and a better player should replace him.

Just because he's a legend/captain, doesn't mean he's special and deserves to start when he's past it/isn't performing.

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