Is Mario Goetze overhyped? The german Jack Wilshire ?

by BigBadBen Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:43 pm

I've watched him a few times, I've seen many of his match comps.

Many people claim he will be the next best player in the world.

All I've seen is some neat short passing, neat dribbling, neat ball control, decent vision and... thats about it.

Basically from what I've seen is that he is a neat & tidy player, he hasn't done anything which has made go 'wow, this guy is good'. He reminds me of Jack Wilshire.

Is Mario Goetze better than Jack Wilshire ? hmm

Where does his hype come from ?

by urbaNRoots Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:49 pm

He's one of the best players that play for the German champions. He's not hyped enough let alone overhyped. Also you can't rate him if you haven't even watched Dortmund and Germany enough.

by Valkyrja Tue Jun 19, 2012 8:23 pm

Better than Neymar IMO.

by la bestia negra Tue Jun 19, 2012 8:26 pm

not overhyped atleast to thoose who watch the bundesliga day in day out

by BigBadBen Tue Jun 19, 2012 8:48 pm

I've saw about 7 live games.

And watched about 12 or so, match compilations of him.

Haven't saw anything great.

He does most of the simple things relatively well, he makes football look easy.

How does he compare to Reus ?

From what I've saw Reus is more talented.

by la bestia negra Tue Jun 19, 2012 10:02 pm

Mario was injured for most of the season
IIRC

i have to agree with you on the rolls reus situation though

by DuringTheWar Tue Jun 19, 2012 10:54 pm

this is the thing with "neat and tidy" players, it takes an astute viewer to see the true size of the talent. Zidane was a "neat and tidy" player, would you say "wow he was good"? when he was younger he had people questioning his hype as well, eventually though the talent shines through to even the most dense viewers

by BigBadBen Tue Jun 19, 2012 11:08 pm

Your right, I'm clearly not astute enough. Poor me.

by REWB Tue Jun 19, 2012 11:31 pm

mario is one of the best talents in the world, i realised this when dortmond faced my own team arsenal. one of the main things with gotze is his amazing movement; he is incredible at finding space and attacking it with very good decision making. you cant see how good a player truly is by looking at videos on youtube, even play by play comps dont show you the true picture of a player. moreover, even watching him live is not enough. imo if you were to see gotze face your own team (man utd) for example, you would understand how good he is.

by juventus101 Tue Jun 19, 2012 11:37 pm

Gotze is one of the few players capable of challenging Messi in the future in my.opinion. Definitely not overrated at all. If anything hes underrated, whereas Hazard and especially Neymar get all the spotlight, Gotze is better than either of them and has more potential.

by BigBadBen Tue Jun 19, 2012 11:56 pm

Fair enough, maybe I'm wrong.

by Ganso Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:15 am

Gotze challenging messi lolwut.....I think he might reach a high level,but he doesn't have the balon dor mojo.

by Le Samourai Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:22 am

Not sure if you're complimenting or bashing here....

On the one hand you're comparing him to Jack who is an amazing player and on the next hand you're calling him overrated.

hmm

by BigBadBen Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:43 am

Le Samourai wrote:Not sure if you're complimenting or bashing here....

On the one hand you're comparing him to Jack who is an amazing player and on the next hand you're calling him overrated.

I'm just curious, some people say he will be amongst the top 3 players in the world at his peak.

He's seems like a good player, but I haven't seen any 'magic', or anything special.

But I've mainly seen him in recent months, when he came back from injury.

So I was just seeing if, the people on this site, rated him highly and what not.

And the Wilshire thing, well, they both remind me of each other, around the same age, around the same size, like to play short passes & 1-2s and both are 'neat and tidy' players. ( they like to keep it simple, no 'hollywood passes')

Gotze seems to be better at dribbling, which is a given ,as he plays further forward.

Also, he gets A LOT more hype than Wilshire (on the sites I visit, anway), but he doesn't seem to be a lot better, from what I've seen.

by Le Samourai Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:49 am

Sometimes simple is magic.

Xavi is a great example of how far neat and simple can take you.

by Toffer Harley Wed Jun 20, 2012 5:39 am

what makes goetze the best youngster germany prolly has had in the last 20 years is the maturity beyond his years. since he stepped onto the scene people got accustomed to the fact that he almost never makes a mistake and that is no overstatement. surely, you will see a few lapses from him if every now and then but he's extremely secure with the ball and mostly makes the right decision.

then there is of course his wide skillset which is already better and more reliable than that of most good players in their prime. he needs to work on his finishing which is a bit predictable with his weird shoving movement and he just doesn't get any spin on the ball most of the time as well.

however, anybody who has seen him and understands football will have to see these things. I even remember watching one of his first games against HSV and after 20 minutes and one incredible control of the ball after a cross across the whole pitch it was pretty much clear what kind of potential he has. and he went on to constantly confirm it....as a 18-20 year old.

imo, in terms of talent it would be an insult to goetze to be thrown into the same category as wilshere and i like arsenal.

by Le Samourai Wed Jun 20, 2012 5:46 am

Insult

You have to be kidding me ffs....did you watch Wilshire against Barca...the guy is legit.

by VivaStPauli Wed Jun 20, 2012 9:17 am

Why would you doubt Götze? Kid has delivered every single time he was played.

You have to understand that he's no flair player, there never will be any magic. There will be goals and assists, effortlessly and perfectly performed. But flair and tricks are for emergencies, those don't happen to players with great vision.

Watching Götze just doesn't look flashy for the most part, but it sure as hell looks impressive if you know what to look at.

by Valkyrja Wed Jun 20, 2012 9:43 am

Toffer Harley wrote:what makes goetze the best youngster germany prolly has had in the last 20 years is the maturity beyond his years. since he stepped onto the scene people got accustomed to the fact that he almost never makes a mistake and that is no overstatement. surely, you will see a few lapses from him if every now and then but he's extremely secure with the ball and mostly makes the right decision.

then there is of course his wide skillset which is already better and more reliable than that of most good players in their prime. he needs to work on his finishing which is a bit predictable with his weird shoving movement and he just doesn't get any spin on the ball most of the time as well.

however, anybody who has seen him and understands football will have to see these things. I even remember watching one of his first games against HSV and after 20 minutes and one incredible control of the ball after a cross across the whole pitch it was pretty much clear what kind of potential he has. and he went on to constantly confirm it....as a 18-20 year old.

imo, in terms of talent it would be an insult to goetze to be thrown into the same category as wilshere and i like arsenal.

Best talent in the last 20 years ? Ozil isn't considered german ?

by urbaNRoots Wed Jun 20, 2012 9:55 am

Toffer Harley wrote:imo, in terms of talent it would be an insult to goetze to be thrown into the same category as wilshere and i like arsenal.

Wilshere is definitely in the same category mate.

by Toffer Harley Wed Jun 20, 2012 11:29 am

Kizu wrote: Best talent in the last 20 years ? Ozil isn't considered german ?

When Oezil was 18 he played for Schalke's youth and looked like this:

Is Mario Goetze overhyped? The german Jack Wilshire ? Mesut_Oezil

When Goetze was 18 he was the main "man" behind Sahin to lead BVB to the championship.

I'm one of Oezil's biggest fans but Goetze has shown greater skill at a younger age relative to him - and that makes him the bigger talent.

by halamadrid2 Wed Jun 20, 2012 12:11 pm

well if Mario is good enough somebody will try to buy him other than the peadophile Wenger, when Ozil was 20 he was one of Germanys best and most talented players when Goetze was 20(which is now) he hardly starts, when Ozil became 20/21 he was followed by Man U, Barca, Arsenal and Real while playing for lowly Werder Bremen, when Goetze was 20 he was followed by Arsenal and ur umm ohh while playing for high flying Dortmund

See i mean doing arguments like that is very retarded, iam sure Goetze will come good tho, but he is not their best talent

by REWB Wed Jun 20, 2012 12:16 pm

Toffer Harley wrote:what makes goetze the best youngster germany prolly has had in the last 20 years is the maturity beyond his years. since he stepped onto the scene people got accustomed to the fact that he almost never makes a mistake and that is no overstatement. surely, you will see a few lapses from him if every now and then but he's extremely secure with the ball and mostly makes the right decision.

then there is of course his wide skillset which is already better and more reliable than that of most good players in their prime. he needs to work on his finishing which is a bit predictable with his weird shoving movement and he just doesn't get any spin on the ball most of the time as well.

however, anybody who has seen him and understands football will have to see these things. I even remember watching one of his first games against HSV and after 20 minutes and one incredible control of the ball after a cross across the whole pitch it was pretty much clear what kind of potential he has. and he went on to constantly confirm it....as a 18-20 year old.

imo, in terms of talent it would be an insult to goetze to be thrown into the same category as wilshere and i like arsenal.

they are different type of players, but i cannot see how it is an insult to compare gotze with wilshere. ill let it go because it's obvious you haven't seen much of wilshere at all.

by DuringTheWar Wed Jun 20, 2012 1:17 pm

Toffer Harley wrote:
imo, in terms of talent it would be an insult to goetze to be thrown into the same category as wilshere and i like arsenal.

did goetze get picked to be in ad with messi? no? didnt think so Afro

funny thing is, everything you described about goetze can be said about wilshere

by Toffer Harley Wed Jun 20, 2012 1:21 pm

The kid will surely leave a more impressive legacy than wilshere, but we can discuss that in 15 years. Players like Wilshere come around more often than players like Goetze, but as said - that's just my opinion.

However, there is absolutely no doubt Goetze is the biggest german talent over the last years, that's common consensus in germany and many experts, DFB officials as well as high ranking current or former players have stated that. But well when it comes to scouting young talent I will trust in the English then.

Furthermore he's frequently linked with clubs other than Arsenal in the same fashion as Oezil was linked with other clubs before WC10, so I have no idea what you are talkin about. In Goetze's case clubs know though that 35+ mill will be required, which was different with Oezil who was a bargain at the time. In fact, in a thread like this back then, where Oezil would have been matched up with Pastore or other comparable randoms, people would have bashed him. Not many people took that guy seriously before WC10 and hardly knew him, Madrid fans also had their doubts. So don't make it look like the whole international football world was already collectively blown away by him.

About Goetze not starting... well he was injured for half a year - shit happens. Apart from that why would Loew start an 20 year old in an already young team over the no.10 from Real Madrid, which is his legitmate position, or one of his trusted role players? Obviously right now Oezil is better, but if Goetze continues his development he will be on eye level and possibly above in 2-3 years.

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