Atlantis, Dinosaurs and the Parallel World

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Post by Jonathan28 Tue Jan 24, 2012 11:37 am

I found this piece on the web whilst messing around last weekend at work, what it contained astonished me.

http://www.world-mysteries.com/mpl_10ra.htm

Atlantis, Dinosaurs and the Parallel World
by Rich Anders

Hardly any mystery of ancient times has appealed to human imagination as much as At-lantis. There is an air of vagueness around this very name that fascinates regardless. Many scholars and scientists have looked for Atlantis. Many have found a theory that mostly nobody else endorses. Nobody has found hard evidence. And yet Atlantis fasci-nates people the world over. What makes Atlantis so special?

Let's deal with the little there has come down to us through the ages:

The Greek Solon the Wise heard about Atlantis from an Egyptian priest when visiting Sais. He was told not only about Atlantis. The priest also informed him about great disas-ters that strike a planet periodically and said it was in the course of one of those global disasters that Atlantis disappeared.

The priest said Atlantis was located outside the Pillars of Hercules, which was the name of the rocks of Gibraltar in ancient times. This puts Atlantis somewhere in the Atlantic, which could be assumed to be the name of the ocean surrounding Atlantis.

Solon brought the knowledge of Atlantis back to Greece and passed it on to a man named Dropides who told his grandson Critias about it. The Greeks were a curious people and loved to discuss things. They had special places for this and special people who were es-pecially good at developing schools of thoughts. Those were called philosophers. One of the most famous ones of this breed of people was Plato.

Plato conducted talks and the most famous of them is the one he held with Critias, the grandson of the provider of the information about Atlantis. There were others present and one of them, Timaeos, mentioned Atlantis in the written texts referring to that a specific discussion.

The Egyptian priest at Saiz who gave the information to Solon was impressed with the advanced civilization of the Atlanteans. This is remarkable because in those ancient times Egypt was thought to be the most advanced civilization there was. The priest mentioned that the Atlanteans were in possession of a very advanced technology. He also claimed that the Atlanteans did not fear death. Either they were immortals or they knew enough about death and the afterlife not to be scared. Most importantly, the priest told his visitor that periodically great cataclysms devastate the planet and that in the course of one such major cataclysm Atlantis disappeared. He did not say "was devastated" he said "disap-peared".

The Greeks of early times that were called the Hellenes knew about a place in the Atlan-tic called Aea. It was said to be place where the sun always was at the center of the sky and the inhabitants of Aea were not afraid of death. It can be assumed that this Aea was to the Hellenes what Atlantis was to the Egyptians. An interesting note: in the very early Greek paintings the sun was always shown in an afternoon position. Ancient texts men-tion that the sun stood always at the same spot. - Both accounts indicate that in those re-mote times the planet did not rotate around its axis.

Many scholars assumed that Atlantis was fictitious and that Plato used the Atlantis story to present his philosophical thoughts on what a perfect society of his time should be like. Had these scholars been familiar with the mythology of ancient times they could have assumed otherwise.
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Plato gives detailed descriptions of Atlantis as a huge island. He marvels at the power and the riches of the King. He presents a form of government, which in his time would have been ideal. He also mentions the god Poseidon as the one in charge of Atlantis. To Plato this made perfectly sense because in the Greek pantheon of gods Poseidon was in charge of anything that had to do with the ocean. Atlantis as a huge island in the ocean, there-fore, for a Greek had to have Poseidon in charge.

Plato overlooked one very significant peculiarity of the various pantheons of gods: they all were locals. The Hellenes had Zeus and his gang of deities called gods whom the Greek took over when they took over Greece after the great cataclysm of approximately 2150 BC that left most Hellenes dead and the country empty. The Romans, the Etruscans, the Teutonic Tribes, the Slavonic tribes, the Celts and so forth, they all had their own pantheon of gods. Had Atlantis been part of the ancient order of things as it was the case in Europe, the Atlanteans would have had their own pantheon of gods. Poseidon had no connection with Atlantis!

Therefore, one can see a break in the story: the information that came from the Egyptian priests tells of a huge landmass in the Atlantic Ocean "outside the Pillars of Hercules". The priest told of a highly developed civilization with very advanced technology. He also claimed that the people of Atlantis had no fear of death. - All of this was alien to the Greek mind. Therefore, it can it can be assumed that Solon got this information from someone non-Greek, the Egyptian priest. It is noteworthy that the Egyptian priest ridi-culed Solon and his fellow Greeks for their lack of knowledge. Clearly, the above was alien to the Greek minds.

What comes next in Plato's account is purely Greek: the Athenians defeating the At-lanteans 9000 years earlier could only have been a Greek fantasy because at that time there was no Athens. Poseidon could not have been in charge of Atlantis because he was a god of the Greek pantheon. He had no business outside the area where his people, the Hellenes and later the Greek lived. So it is very clear that Plato used the story of Atlantis to invent a further story as add on to the original.

Having neatly separated the original story from Plato's follow-up philosophical yarn the question remains: what is the real story of Atlantis? What fascinates people to the point that thousands of books were written about a topic that nobody knows anything about?

Whatever we know about ancient times is documented in structures like temples, pyra-mids, historical accounts or mythology. There are artifacts to be found or stories of events to be learned. Nothing like this ever could be credibly linked to Atlantis. There is no sunken continent anywhere to be seen. There are no remnants of buildings that can be cross- referenced to Atlantis and there are no accounts of anything historical about Atlan-tis. There are no names of rulers and no information about the civilization and technology the Atlanteans possessed. Is Atlantis just a myth as many claim?

As there are no tangible witnesses telling of Atlantis the only real source of information can be legends and myths of ancient times that might relate to Atlantis or the Atlanteans.
Also, the concept of parallel worlds and of a change of worlds needs to be addressed.
This is not the right place to explain what a change of worlds or a change of dimensions is. The topic is difficult and it would take too much time and space to deal with it here. In my article The Time/Space Dis-Continuum published at world-mysteries.com such changes and the forces at work to bring such changes are described in detail. For the pur-pose of this article let's assume that there is a parallel world.

The Egyptian priest at Sais told his Greek visitor of great cataclysms, which periodically hit this planet. He said that Atlantis disappeared in the course of one such event. He did not say Atlantis was destroyed, he specifically mentioned that it disappeared. This is an indication that this event was accompanied by a change of worlds or change of dimen-sions as one could call it, too.

There is another indication that there was indeed a change of worlds. In the ancient Greece of Hellenic times the sun always was depicted standing in an afternoon position at the same spot. During those times the planet did not revolve around an axis. Later Greek paintings show the sun in different positions. For thousands of years this planet has been revolving around an axis. Clearly, this is an indication that in the world before the planet did not revolve around an axis.

Furthermore, the predecessors of the Greek, the Hellenic people, knew of a place in the Atlantic called Aea. According to legend, its inhabitants were technologically very ad-vanced and they did not fear death. Either they were immortals or they knew enough about death not to fear it. Most importantly, though, it was told that over Aea the sun was always in the midday position. This is yet another indication that as long as the parallel world, the paradise, existed this planet did not revolve around an axis.


A further possible source of information about the Atlanteans is the Edda, the saga of the ancient Nordic people. It predicts the Twilight of the Gods, which is a faulty translation of an original text in which it is called The End of the Gods.

In the Edda there is a lengthy account of how the gods of the Nordic pantheon are over-powered and killed by a variety of other gods, monsters or the forces of nature. After they all have perished, miraculously, a brand new beautiful world appears, which shows no signs of the utter devastation that brought the preceding world to an end. This is a very clear statement, which only can refer to a change of worlds respectively a change of di-mensions.

There is very convincing evidence that there were gods living among humans before but there are no gods in this world. The world before is remembered dimly as the paradise lost. The question must be: how do cruel, bloodthirsty gods who exploited mankind to the point of slaughtering sometimes thousands of humans at a time in sacrificial ceremonies designed to boost their energies fit in paradise?

The sudden appearance of 5 centers of civilization about 5500 years ago indicates an in-vasion from space. The alien gods invaded the world before, the paradise, and changed it to their ways by oppressing and exploiting humans. Then, according to Greek accounts, the gods suddenly disappeared about 3500 years ago. But are they really gone for good?

In this world slaughters of humans at a grand scale always took place and it is still going on. People like Alexander, the Great; Attila, the Hun; Kublai Khan; Napoleon; Hitler; Stalin etc. caused the deaths of millions of people and brought unspeakable misery and suffering to millions more. The Soviet Premier Nikita Chroushchov provoked the Cuban Missile Crises and all life on this planet came to within two hours of extinction. Even if the gods are not around any more in their original bodies the evil deeds of many of man-kind's leaders tell of their origin. These must be reincarnations of the ancient gods follow-ing a destiny they know nothing about and yet they bring suffering and death to a tor-mented mankind.


These considerations bring an interesting twist to the Edda. Obviously, the end of the gods must come as a one-two punch. The first punch happened when the last change of dimensions annihilated the alien gods in physical form because this world is a place for humans only. The second punch must be the next change of worlds, which will annihilate these evil creatures in their disguise as humans. This change will be from the present world to the next one, which is announced as a beautiful New World that will show no sign of the devastation that brought an end to the preceding world. Consequently, it is this present world, which will be utterly and totally destroyed.

The Edda is very clear about the end of the gods. It is also very clear about the beautiful New World to come afterwards. It is clear that the Edda talks about the return of paradise cleansed from the invaders from space. The Edda also talked about good gods who were here before the evil gods invaded this planet. The evil gods were afraid of them and this tells a big story. Clearly, the good gods were the ones living in paradise and when the beautiful New World, the paradise, comes back these good gods are the ones to come back again. There are no accounts of superior beings of prehistoric times except for the Atlanteans. Consequently, it is logical to assume that Atlantis and the Atlanteans will ap-pear together with this beautiful New World the Edda announces.

There is strong evidence that there was a different world at some time past, a world with different animal life. This evidence was found at Ica in the Andes of South America. A simple farmer found etched stones with the images of humans interacting with live dino-saurs that were depicted anatomically correct. This happened 1966 when science had not yet reached a level of knowledge of dinosaurs, which made a correct assessment of dino-saur anatomies possible.
There were many thousands of these stones showing men riding dinosaurs, children play-ing with them and men getting killed in fights with dinosaurs or killing them. This find caused a sensation in the scientific community. Dinosaurs went extinct 67 million years ago. At that time humans did not exist. The etchings could not be duplicated in exactly the same manner with present technology. Scientists tried in vain to explain this impossi-ble situation and, therefore, avoid this issue.

Another mystery are stones with etchings of this planet's surface. It shows the location of the continents where compared to present geography they were 13 million years ago. This cannot be explained by conventional science. But if there was indeed a parallel world on this planet, fantastic as this sounds, it could be that not only plant and animal life evolved differently. It could be that the planet's surface in the world before had evolved only to the level where this world's surface was 13 million years ago.


There is another case like the Ica stones. At Acambaro in Mexico thousands of clay figu-rines were found and many of them show different species of dinosaurs. These figurines show anatomic details of dinosaurs science only lately has found out. Furthermore, figu-rines of humans and dinosaurs together give the same message as the stones of Ica; there was indeed a world on this planet's surface where humans and dinosaurs existed together. Some of the figurines show children playing with dinosaurs. Others show a person riding a dinosaur. There are also figurines showing humans and dinosaurs fighting. One figurine is especially impressive. It shows a human on top of a dinosaur and the animal has its tailed coiled around the human's neck clearly choking him because the man has his tongue sticking out and he does not look happy.

There are examples all over the world that at some time in the distant past humans knew about dinosaurs. For instance, on a Sumerian cylinder seal are pictures of two brachio-saurus with the necks intertwined. An Egyptian painting shows black men hunting a di-nosaur at a riverbank. Germanic lore talks of dragons in many different stories. A little town in Austria, Klagenfurt, has a huge dinosaur statue in the center of its town square. They call it Lindwurm and legend has it that the town was founded on the site where a brave knight slew the dragon. The same type of animal is known in Vienna as the Tatzelwurm. Even the bible has its dinosaur story: St. George slaying a dragon. - How these dinos made it into the present world is a mystery. But it is less of a mystery consid-ering that they could have originated in a world that disappeared 3500 years ago than try-ing to figure out how they survived 67 million years after the alleged total extinction of all dinosaurs.


If one believes that there exists indeed a parallel world with very different living condi-tions, a different plant and animal life the stones of Ica, the figurines of Acambaro and the other examples have a dramatic impact. The world before, the paradise lost, clearly had a very different kind of evolution than the present world. In this world there was no extinction of dinosaurs and they existed at the same time as did humans.

The above examples are the most mind boggling and the most irrefutable proof that there indeed was a world before the present one, a world, which was very different from ours. Add to this the fact that instant changes in the electromagnetic structure of a planet cause instant changes in the planet's matter and the fascinating possibility of a change of worlds becomes feasible.

Reading Sumerian Epics and other ancient accounts it is very clear that the change from paradise to the present world was sudden, radical and total. Climate, plant growth and animal life is different the present world and there are no gods in physical form. Greek, Sumerian, Egyptian and other mythologies tell of a time when gods lived among humans. There are many stories of relationships, sexual and others, between gods and humans. Suddenly that stopped and we even know when that happened.

There were several great floods that devastated this planet. The Sumerians accounted for a devastating flood about 3100 BC and they used this date to discern between a pre-diluvian and post-diluvian history. Very probably the Great Flood mentioned in the Bible refers to the same event. There is one great flood mentioned in Greek traditions and it struck around 1500 BC. It is called Deukalion's flood because he and his wife were the only gods to survive it. All the other gods perished in the course of this cataclysm. It is known from mythological accounts that the two survivors were actually demigods as they were the results of unions between a god and a human, which probably is the reason why they survived.

No matter how great a catastrophe, the forces of nature do not selectively annihilate a specific kind of people. This only can happen after a change when the new material di-mension does not provide suitable living conditions for a specific kind of people or ani-mals. The mass extinction of animals, for instance, after the Perm, the Trias and the Ju-rassic period is a clear indication that this happened before.

Ancient structures many of which we don't understand can be found all over the world and they relate to humans like temples or pyramids, which were used for human sacri-fices. However, no gods and nothing that belonged to them can be found even though the mythology of many nations gives many detailed accounts of gods and their stay on Earth.


Generally it is assumed that gods were invented by humans about 5600 years ago when humans suddenly had the urge to worship superior beings who exploited, tortured, abused and killed them in sacrificial rites. But there have been no gods around for a long time and there is nothing we can directly relate to gods. Consequently, it is erroneously as-sumed that there never were any gods at all.

Taking into account the possibility of a change of worlds respectively a change of dimen-sions the picture changes dramatically. In the previous change of worlds structures like temples and pyramids, mute witnesses like the stones of Ica and the clay figurines of Acambaro, legends, mythologies, history, religious systems and the traditions of humans all over the world did not change. Together with humans they made it into the present world and there is plenty of evidence in these accounts that in ancient times gods and even dinosaurs really lived among humans in physical form.

In view of the above the conclusion is obvious: the Atlanteans were gods who did not make it into the present world. Nothing that belonged to them did. No temples or pyra-mids can be found that can reliably be linked to Atlantis. Clearly, the Atlanteans did not use religion as a means to exploit the humans living in their territories if there were any. This is a further indication that the Atlanteans in all likelihood were the good gods the Edda is talking about, the ones the evil Aesir gods feared. Therefore, all the theories about locations of Atlantis in this world are mere assumptions, which are altogether wrong. Atlantis and everything that belonged to it remained in the parallel world, the paradise, which disappeared about 3500 years ago.


The Edda announced a brand new beautiful world to appear after the total destruction of the present world of violence. Legends tell of the paradise lost. Jesus talked of his king-dom to come as a world of love and peace. If this world is the return of paradise Atlantis, for sure, will reappear with this paradise and then, at long last, the exact location and the existence of Atlantis will be an established fact.


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Last edited by Ordinho10 on Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:02 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Post by kiranr Tue Jan 24, 2012 11:57 am


What is this change of world/dimension that he keeps talking about?

Just did not understand what he is trying to say...
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Post by Senor Penguin Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:02 pm

Mind blown because of the amount of rubbish people can compile.

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Post by Jonathan28 Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:06 pm

kiranr wrote:
What is this change of world/dimension that he keeps talking about?

Just did not understand what he is trying to say...

He talks about it in this piece.

http://www.world-mysteries.com/sci_2.htm#Time

The Time/Space Dis-Continuum

An Article by Rich Anders



Dead animals cannot speak. Nonetheless, sometimes they tell a story. Of all the ones that do there is one mammoth, which tells the most remarkable of all. It is not the mammoth's size, which makes this story so impressive. It is the story's uniqueness. There are other animals involved in the same kind of story telling, but none of them tells the story so crystal clear. The story itself is quite simple:

the mammoth died a sudden death. Its body was deep-frozen instantly. When the mammoth was found in the Siberian permafrost region thousands of years later, its body tissue was so well preserved that the sledge dogs very eagerly fed on it. In fact, the mammoth's body had not decomposed at all as it was subjected to freezing conditions in it's solitary grave.

There are many stories of mammoths roaming the glacial planes of Europe and Siberia. I always wandered where these huge animals found enough food to live on in a cold climate where but little vegetation could exist. The Siberian mammoth finally gave an answer to this baffling question that made sense: those planes were not glacial, they were subtropical and in other more distant locations there was steppe vegetation as proven by the most recent findings.

This mammoth had plants in its stomach and even in its mouth undigested and very well preserved by the subzero temperatures. All these were plants as found in a subtropical climate. - The plants made this mammoth a scientific sensation. For if the mammoth lived in a subtropical climate, how come it was deep-frozen so quickly as not to decompose even a little?

The author lives in a subtropical climate. From experience one knows that everything decomposes very fast under the impact of heat and the sun's intense radiation. No dead organic matter can defy these forces. It cannot be assumed that this dead mammoth would not have reacted to these factors of a subtropical climate. Had it been exposed to heat only for one day, the signs of beginning decomposition would have been clearly visible. But there were none! The only conclusion possible at all is: the climate must have changed from subtropical to arctic in a very short time. It is this very point of the mammoth's story, which makes it an utterly controversial one.

Cataclysmic evolutionists made this mammoth one of their main arguments in favor of their theories. All the others preferred to overlook it or tried to explain this obvious conclusion away. And yet, this mammoth proves very clearly: there must exist somehow the possibility for the climate to change practically from one moment to the next and very drastically so. For in this case it was not a change of several degrees of latitude. This was a dramatic change, which by its very nature shows it shifted the climatic zones over at least a quarter of the globe. This, in turn, means that the poles' locations had changed, too. It cannot have been a gradual change as some cataclysmic evolutionists suggest; it must have been a change, which took place in an instant. This point ads further spice to the mammoth's story, for it is precisely this point which upsets many orthodox scientific theories.

A very important question has to be answered: which forces were able to cause such a dramatic change and were able to do so many times in our planet's history? For if the poles can indeed jump, then the signs of glacial activity all over the globe prove that the poles have jumped many times. This fact also shows it is nonsensical to assume that a. passing cosmic dust cloud was responsible for a cooling of the planet at a specific time thus causing Glaciation. Studies have shown that when on one side of the globe there was extensive Glaciation, then on the opposite side the same was the case. In between there were climates as they normally do occur in between poles. Consequently, the so-called ice times are not exceptional conditions of the entire globe; they just show where the arctic and Antarctic regions were located at specific times of the planet's history.

Europe's and North Americas ice times just tell us that one of the poles was located somewhere in the area, which then was covered by ice. It is not this articles purpose to repeat the arguments for a cataclysmic evolution. There are enough publications dealing with this topic and some are good enough to prove the point. Many have discovered the evidence and presented it to the public. But the big question still unanswered is the evidence of what? Which forces can cause jumps of the poles in less than a day? Which principles are at work?

NASA's confirmed the notion that the universe is a gigantic electromagnetic structure with the discovery that the gas planets' systems of rings and moons are arranged along the lines of their electromagnetic fields. Cosmically and physically speaking, electromagnetism determines the location of matter and, therefore, the location of the poles, as well. Hence, changes in a planets electromagnetic structure are responsible when the poles jump.

Scientists at Leipzig University in Eastern Germany developed the model that this planet is functioning like a gigantic dynamo. The inner core with its content of heavy metals is the anchor, the liquid magma works like a clutch and the lighter ores in the planets crust act as the windings. The heavy core moves at a lesser speed than the lighter crust of the planet. Metals and ores have magnetic properties. As their field lines intersect, mechanical energy is converted into electric energy; the planet is charged up electromagnetically! Thus, the planet builds up its own electromagnetic field. But the Leipzig study has more to it; it proves that the system is highly unstable.

It is known that electromagnetic fields can change polarity. Consequently, this applies to a planetary electromagnetic field, as well. The ridges on the ocean floors bear witness to this statement. Those ridges were formed one after another during major cataclysms that struck this planet. The direction of the magnetic particles in the ridges' lava shows that these major cataclysms were accompanied by shifts of the poles' locations. A ridge builds up as lava flows out on to the ocean floor. As the lava cools down the magnetic particles in it become stabilized in their respective locations. Therefore, measurements of the directions of the magnetized particles enclosed in the ridges' lava show the location of the poles at the time when the lava cooled down. Measurements of the magnetic particles included in the various ridges' lava by the research vessel Glomar Challenger show that the direction they point to changed diametrically at least 170 times in the last 70 million years.

There exist studies claiming that these dramatic exchanges of the poles' locations as shown in the lava depict only the major cataclysms and that there is compelling evidence that lesser dislocations of the poles have taken place as well in great numbers. Therefore, the question must be: why do poles change their locations at all and why so often?" Since the electromagnetic field of the planet must determine such changes, the question must further be: "what causes such dramatic changes in the planetary electromagnetic structure?"

Electromagnetic forces determine the location of a planets poles and the configurations of planetary systems. To state this very clearly: the planets, the moons, the rings of matter, the asteroid belt as well as comets and meteors; everything within the solar family owes its respective cosmic location to the force of electromagnetism. If the location of a planets poles and its orbit is determined by its electromagnetic role in the concert of cosmic bodies within the Solar System, what happens when something changes drastically in its electromagnetic structure?

An electromagnetic field forms according to the factors, which contribute to it. If these factors change the electromagnetic field changes accordingly. This means that adding or discharging energy changes a planet's energy potential resulting in a different electromagnetic field. Such changes in energy can diminish or strengthen the electromagnetic field locally and, thus, produce a different configuration. This field determines the location of the poles. So, when the electromagnetic field changes enough the locations of the poles change, as well. Therefore, an addition or discharge of energy and local changes in the strength of the field are the logical explanation for a shift of the location of a planet's poles. It can also be the explanation for a change of orbit! - At first sight, this seems a far out claim. But the laws of electromagnetism are the same for small and big bodies of matter.

A planets orbit is determined by the same principles as an electrons orbit: by its charge, which allocates to the planet an orbit within the solar systems electromagnetic structure. Consequently, it is logical to assume that planets can indeed change orbits when their charge of energy changes sufficiently.

At this point several questions arise: "how can such dramatic events take place? What can change a planets electromagnetic charge so dramatically that major changes in a planets electromagnetic structure occur?

When an electron receives or releases a photon its energy potential changes and it jumps orbit. Planets receive energy from collisions with cosmic bodies like hits by a comet or a meteor. Planets release energy in volcanic eruptions. In either case if the change in a planets electromagnetic charge is significant a jump of the poles or even an orbit jump can take place. This is confirmed by reports from the distant past. The Maya and the Chinese claimed that after a major natural disaster the sun appeared smaller and the moon appeared bigger. This was possible only if the distances between the Earth and the Sun respectively the moon had changed in the course of such an event.

Now the question arises: how does matter experience these energetic processes? The Siberian mammoth gives us a very short span of time for matter to follow energy's lead. The material evidence allows less than a day for a jump of the poles and movies show how it happens.

I always liked those movies where the hero is in terrible danger but manages to escape. The next scene shows the same man with the damsel saved from distress. Happy end.
I do not imply that Mother Nature imitates Hollywood. But let's visualize how a movie is made: it is the quick succession of pictures each of which shows a little progress as compared to the preceding one. These pictures follow so rapidly that the eye sees only the consecutive action. Unless there is a cut one cannot see the single pictures change. The cut from the scene with the hero in danger to the scene of the happy ending, however, shows that the whole movie consists of single pictures rapidly succeeding one another.

To behave according to this example a material dimension has to consist of tiny particles oscillating between the phases of energy and matter so rapidly that we perceive matter as a stable material dimension. Only a cut would dramatically remind us that the stability of matter is but an illusion. We then would realize that we do not exist in a time/space continuum but in a time/space Dis-continuum!


There are rumors dating back to ancient times that matter is indeed made up of tiny particles, too small to be perceived as such and following one another so rapidly that we experience matter as seemingly stable. Such concepts of the ancient Harappans in the Indus Valley and of the Greek philosophers of antiquity did not stand much of a chance to be taken seriously by Western scientists. Not even the discovery of the atom, which vindicated ancient Greek knowledge, did make much impression. So, a few learned men were genuinely surprised when the oscillation of matter between the stages of energy and matter was discovered at Heidelberg University in Germany. And yet, this finding was much more than the vindication of knowledge from ancient times.

The discovery that matter oscillates between the stages of matter and energy is of absolutely highest importance. Add to this the latest theories about the quantum vacuum and we have the basis for explaining fundamental changes in the material realm, which are caused by the changes in the electromagnetic structure of a planet or of the Solar System. So let's deal with a change in the charge of a planets energy in terms of these oscillating particles that constitute matter.

A planet experiences a change of its charge of energy in an energy phase. As there is no time in the realm of energy this adjustment takes place instantly and creates a new energy situation; The next matter phase is formed already with the adjusted energy situation in existence. From then on the planetary movie goes on without any cuts until the next adjustment of the planetary energy situation. But what exactly happened in the energy phase of the change and the following matter phase, which was formed with a changed electromagnetic field?

An addition or a discharge of energy changes the contributing factors to a planets electromagnetic field but the changes are not uniform all over the planet. When the distribution of electromagnetic energy over the planet changes a dramatically different electromagnetic field can appear from one moment to the next. Since the adjustment to the new energy situation takes place in a single energy phase, which produces a different electromagnetic field in the next matter phase, a jump of the poles takes place in a fraction of a second as it takes no time at all.

This means that just like electrons planets experience jumps of their poles and possibly even of their orbits in a split second, for energy is not subjected to the limitations of space and time. Such jumps take place during the energy phase while the entire planet is energy as it exists in the so-called quantum vacuum. In the quantum vacuum there is no time, no space and everything is interrelated. Thus, a planet experiences a jump of the poles or changes over to a new cosmic location in the energy phase, which experienced the discharge or the addition of energy. After this dramatic energy phase the planet appears in its next matter phase with a new location of its poles and possibly even in a new cosmic location, the one it belongs to because of its new electromagnetic field and new electromagnetic charge.

One might ask how time fits into the picture. Time is a function of the oscillation of matter, which continuously produces tiny units of time as the matter phases appear one after another. Time is not constant. When matter oscillations appear more frequently within a specific frame of movement time passes faster, for instance, when matter moves through space at a relatively slow rate. When matter oscillations appear less frequently within a specific frame of movement because it is moving at high speed through space time passes more slowly. There is this famous example of the rapidly accelerating space ship whose crew ages more slowly than the inhabitants of the planet it left behind. - Einstein's theory of relativity provides the scientific explanation. Therefore, as polar shifts and jumps of orbits take place in the energy phase time is not a factor.

To sum up: the locations of a planets poles and its orbit are determined by its electromagnetic charge. Therefore, a new very different electromagnetic field can indeed bring a different location of the poles and possibly even in a new orbit for a planet resulting in a new material dimension.

Matter follows energy's lead!

A sudden shift in the poles' locations triggers major cataclysms. As the rotational plane changes the planet's matter is subjected to the forces of inertia reacting to this change. The water in oceans and lakes suddenly are moved in a different direction. The water is piled up and tremendous waves pound the coastlines. Ancient legends tell of floods, which reached hundreds of miles into continents destroying everything in their paths. The Biblical Flood and the Great Flood mentioned in the Epic of Gilgamesh for sure were caused by such an event. Legends from South America tell of a time, when ocean waves piled up more than a mile high on the western edge of the Andes.

The atmosphere from one moment to the other is moved in a different direction while inertia keeps the air in its previous path. Hurricanes and tornadoes pale in comparison to the forces of winds unleashed in this scenario. The areas water can't reach are hit hard by storms, which can reach wind speeds of hundreds of miles.

The sudden shift in the rotation of the planet breaks open the Earth's crust and lava flows cover wide areas. There is evidence, for instance in the Columbia plateau that such lava flows can extend and have extended over the low lands of entire continents. Continental shelves slam into ocean floors. New mountain ranges form and existing formations are forced high up. The Andes in South America are a very good example of such events, which explains sandy beaches and sea shells thousands of feet up. The same situation is found in the Alps, where seashells and fossilized sea creatures are found high up together with sandy beaches - and this in the middle of a continent. Many volcanoes erupt and spew huge amounts of dust high into the atmosphere.

The climate all over the planet changes at the moment of the jump of the poles. Depending on the new location of the poles tropical lands can become deep frozen in an instant, as the deep temperature and raging ice cold winds tear the warmth out of everything in the new polar region. Other climatic zones change in an instant according to their new location.


There is ample evidence of polar jumps all over the planet, as traces of Glaciation are found everywhere. The impact of these events on biological organisms is devastating. Not only is the loss of life horrendous. If a jump of the poles is accompanied by an orbital jump the temperature range of the entire planet will change. Species not suited to live in this range will be wiped out.

This explains why in the course of the Earth's history sometimes up to 90 percent of the species were wiped out. - The Perm, Trias and the Jurassic extinctions are well-documented examples.

But extinctions did not happen only in remote geological times. The last one wiped out the mammoths, the mastodons, saber tooth tigers and other so-called ice age animals only several thousand years ago. Fossil remains and geological evidence proof beyond the shadow of a doubt that the cycles of creation, evolution, and destruction are part of this planet's history. Life as such has survived all these cataclysms but there is no way telling which life forms will survive such a brutal scenario.

There is evidence of polar jumps during the last 50,000 years after humans had appeared on the fossil record. Humans survived where other species died out. It remains to be seen how humans will fare when the next jump of the poles takes place.


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Post by Jonathan28 Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:12 pm

Senor Penguin wrote:Mind blown because of the amount of rubbish people can compile.

Ah, thats the same view people held when Earatosthenes, Aristarxus, Galileo, Aristotle and the writers of Genesis said that the earth was round.
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Post by Senor Penguin Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:20 pm

Ordinho10 wrote:
Senor Penguin wrote:Mind blown because of the amount of rubbish people can compile.

Ah, thats the same view people held when Earatosthenes, Aristarxus, Galileo, Aristotle and the writers of Genesis said that the earth was round.
Quite an apt analogy. It sure makes these hoaxes more believable.

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Post by VivaStPauli Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:05 pm

Fan fact:
Atlantis was made up by Plato to illustrate a point.

Funny how people still try to find it.

What else are they looking for? Are they trying to dig up Sir Thomas More's Utopia as well?

Might as well go out and try to find the ruins of Gondor. :coffee:
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Post by kiranr Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:12 pm

Isn't that a description of the movie day after tomorrow?
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Post by Senor Penguin Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:27 pm

VivaStPauli wrote:Fan fact:
Atlantis was made up by Plato to illustrate a point.
Fun fact #2:
Humans did not co-exist with dinosaurs. Period.

Fun fact #3:
The depictions of dinosaurs and humans are hoaxes.

Fun fact #4:
The whole post is full of unfounded claims that can only be believed if one is credulous.

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Post by kiranr Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:33 pm

Senor Penguin wrote:
VivaStPauli wrote:Fan fact:
Atlantis was made up by Plato to illustrate a point.
Fun fact #2:
Humans did not co-exist with dinosaurs. Period.

Fun fact #3:
The depictions of dinosaurs and humans are hoaxes.

Fun fact #4:
The whole post is full of unfounded claims that can only be believed if one is credulous.

Is there an proof they are hoaxes?
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Post by Senor Penguin Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:42 pm

kiranr wrote:
Senor Penguin wrote:
VivaStPauli wrote:Fan fact:
Atlantis was made up by Plato to illustrate a point.
Fun fact #2:
Humans did not co-exist with dinosaurs. Period.

Fun fact #3:
The depictions of dinosaurs and humans are hoaxes.

Fun fact #4:
The whole post is full of unfounded claims that can only be believed if one is credulous.

Is there an proof they are hoaxes?
http://www.skepdic.com/icastones.html

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Post by kiranr Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:49 pm

Senor Penguin wrote:
http://www.skepdic.com/icastones.html

:bow: What a website Senor! Thanks a ton!
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Post by Senor Penguin Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:16 pm

kiranr wrote:
Senor Penguin wrote:
http://www.skepdic.com/icastones.html

:bow: What a website Senor! Thanks a ton!
Indeed it is. You're welcome sir!

It comes as no surprise to me that the "evidence" is a hoax. It's not at all uncommon to find adulterated evidence within archeology at places begging for tourism or at archaeological sites that are run by charlatans. A case in point would be the Bosnian (non)pyramids. They're basically a bunch of mountains, pyramidal in shape, claimed to be man-made or shaped by man. A great deal of "evidence" there is suspected and shows signs of being adulterated. Coincidentally, the very same pseudo-scientific babble is seen amongst the circles supporting it.

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Post by Jonathan28 Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:35 pm

Senor Penguin wrote:
VivaStPauli wrote:Fan fact:
Atlantis was made up by Plato to illustrate a point.
Fun fact #2:
Humans did not co-exist with dinosaurs. Period.

Fun fact #3:
The depictions of dinosaurs and humans are hoaxes.

Fun fact #4:
The whole post is full of unfounded claims that can only be believed if one is credulous.

I can agree with fun facts 2-4 since our knowledge on the matter is limited due to no one of us having been around to know for sure. But I totally disagree on fun fact 1. Plato did not come up with some mythical continent just to illustrate a point, the way he used the knowledge of that lost continent to furthur his own agenda is a different argument all together, so we sort of agree there.

I used to think Atlantis was made up aswell, until I read the stuff below.


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Post by Jonathan28 Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:45 pm

Why is it that after thousands of years, so many of us still search for the answer to this mystery? Did it exist or didn't it. We can't seem to let go of it, as if deep down we know it existed, as though we possess some collective memory of it within our subconcious, which doesn't let us accept it as myth. Like the ghost of someone long gone that lingers on until the mystery of their death has been resolved and they can finally be at peace, their story having been told.

Ever since the first recorded history of Atlantis, written by the Greek philosopher Plato over 2,360 years ago, debate has raged as to whether or not Atlantis ever really existed. Plato described it as an extraordinary Utopian society, thriving around 9,600 BC, which valued peace, art and wisdom, possessed advanced technological knowledge for the time, and enjoyed riches beyond that of any subsequent civilization. The land was said to have been very fertile, with abundant food, water, animals, wood, and flowers. But, as the story goes, after several generations of ruling the leaders became increasingly greedy and corrupt, and started to wage war on their neighbouring countries. They conquered parts of North Africa and Europe and were about to attack Egypt and Athens, when the Athenian army valiantly drove them back and defeated them. It is shortly after this victory by the Athenians that violent and devastating earthquakes, and the resulting tidal waves and floods, destroyed the Athenian army, as well as the entire Island continent of Atlantis, submerging it beneath the sea "in a single day and night".

The question is : Did Plato write this as a moralistic story, or as a true historical account?


Plato's 2 writings pertaining to Atlantis are the "Timaeus", and the "Critias", written in 360BC, at which time Plato would have been aged about 67 or 68. These are the earliest known written records about the Lost Continent of Atlantis, all other written references to Atlantis have been written since, and have been based on these writings by Plato.

The Timaeus and the Critias are actually written in the form of dialogues between 4 main characters: Socrates (.Greek philosopher, and Plato's teacher.), Critias (.poet & historian.), Timaeus (.an Italian astronomer.), and Hermocrates (.a general from Syracuse.). All were real people.
The Timaeus includes only a passing reference to Atlantis, but the second writing, the Critias, has a much more in depth description of Atlantis leading upto it's downfall.

The story is told by the character Critias, who was possibly Plato's maternal great-grandfather. Critias had heard the story as a child from his own Grandfather, Critias the Elder, who had heard it from his father Dropides, who had heard it from his friend Solon, a great Athenian Law-giver reputed to have been an honest and true man.
Solon had been told the story of Atlantis during his stay in Sais, Egypt, by an elderly Egytian priest who claimed to have acquired the knowledge directly from ancient records in his keeping. After hearing of the account, Solon had intended to record it himself, for posterity's sake, but for one reason or another he never did.
Just for the record, Solon really did visit Sais, Egypt, although the date Plato gives for this is about 20 years off. This at least is indisputable fact.

The Egyptian records that the priest was referencing have to this day never been found. But there are theories that hidden in a hall underneath the sphinx, or in the top of the great pyramid, is a secret chamber containing ancient records of invaluable historical, and perhaps future, importance. Several excavations have been attempted to find this secret room, but all have lead to dead ends. It is unknown exactly where this rumor originated, it may have been Edgar Cayce, an American psychic / clairvoyant of the early 1900's, who predicted (sometime before his death in 1945) that in 1998 a "Hall of Records" would be found.
According to Cayce, the contents of the hall and the location are as follows:

"A record of Atlantis from the beginning of those periods when the Spirit took form, or began the encasements in that land; and the developments of the peoples throughout their sojourn; together with the record of the first destruction, and the changes that took place in the land; with the record of the sojournings of the peoples and their varied activities in other lands, and a record of the meetings of all the nations or lands, for the activities in the destruction of Atlantis; and the building of the pyramid of initiation, together with whom, what, and where the opening of the records would come, that are as copies from the sunken Atlantis. For with the change, it [Atlantis] must rise again. In position, this lies -- as the sun rises from the waters -- as the line of the shadows (or light) falls between the paws of the Sphinx; that was set later as the sentinel or guard and which may not be entered from the connecting chambers from the Sphinx's right paw until the time has been fulfilled when the changes must be active in this sphere of man's experience."


_____________________

The Story...
_____________________

Plato was writing the Timaeus and the Critias as the first 2 parts of a trilogy, which was to follow on from one of his previous works called The Republic, and it is believed that in this trilogy Atlantis was going to play a significant part.
But as you will notice when you read the Critias excerpt below, he never finished it! It breaks off at the most exciting part, never to be finished, or if it was finished, the end part has been lost. So, out of the trilogy only the first book was completed, the second was half done, and the third was never even started.

Excerpt from The : Timaeus


Critias says :

Many great and wonderful deeds are recorded of your state in our histories. But one of them exceeds all the rest in greatness and valour. For these histories tell of a mighty power which unprovoked, made an expedition against the whole of Europe and Asia, and to which your city put an end. This power came forth out of the Atlantic Ocean, for in those days the Atlantic was navigable; and there was an island situated in front of the straits which are by you called the Pillars of Heracles; the island was larger than Libya and Asia put together, and was the way to other islands, and from these you might pass to the whole of the opposite continent which surrounded the true ocean; for this sea which is within the Straits of Heracles is only a harbour, having a narrow entrance, but that other is a real sea, and the surrounding land may be most truly called a boundless continent. Now in this island of Atlantis there was a great and wonderful empire which had rule over the whole island and several others, and over parts of the continent, and, furthermore, the men of Atlantis had subjected the parts of Libya within the columns of Heracles as far as Egypt, and of Europe as far as Tyrrhenia (Italy).
This vast power, gathered into one, endeavoured to subdue at a blow our country and yours and the whole of the region within the straits; and then, Solon, your country shone forth, in the excellence of her virtue and strength, among all mankind. She was pre-eminent in courage and military skill, and was the leader of the Hellenes. And when the rest fell off from her, being compelled to stand alone, after having undergone the very extremity of danger, she defeated and triumphed over the invaders, and preserved from slavery those who were not yet subjugated, and generously liberated all the rest of us who dwell within the pillars. But afterwards there occurred violent earthquakes and floods; and in a single day and night of misfortune all your warlike men in a body sank into the earth, and the island of Atlantis in like manner disappeared in the depths of the sea. For which reason the sea in those parts is impassable and impenetrable, because there is a shoal of mud in the way; and this was caused by the subsidence of the island.

Excerpt from The : Critias


Critias says :

Let me begin by observing first of all, that nine thousand was the sum of years which had elapsed since the war which was said to have taken place between those who dwelt outside the Pillars of Heracles and all who dwelt within them; this war I am going to describe. Of the combatants on the one side, the city of Athens was reported to have been the leader and to have fought out the war; the combatants on the other side were commanded by the kings of Atlantis, which, as was saying, was an island greater in extent than Libya and Asia, and when afterwards sunk by an earthquake, became an impassable barrier of mud to voyagers sailing from hence to any part of the ocean. The progress of the history will unfold the various nations of barbarians and families of Hellenes which then existed, as they successively appear on the scene; but I must describe first of all Athenians of that day, and their enemies who fought with them, and then the respective powers and governments of the two kingdoms. Let us give the precedence to Athens.

In the days of old the gods had the whole earth distributed among them by allotment. There was no quarrelling; for you cannot rightly suppose that the gods did not know what was proper for each of them to have, or, knowing this, that they would seek to procure for themselves by contention that which more properly belonged to others. They all of them by just apportionment obtained what they wanted, and peopled their own districts; and when they had peopled them they tended us, their nurselings and possessions, as shepherds tend their flocks, excepting only that they did not use blows or bodily force, as shepherds do, but governed us like pilots from the stern of the vessel, which is an easy way of guiding animals, holding our souls by the rudder of persuasion according to their own pleasure;-thus did they guide all mortal creatures. Now different gods had their allotments in different places which they set in order. Hephaestus and Athene, who were brother and sister, and sprang from the same father, having a common nature, and being united also in the love of philosophy and art, both obtained as their common portion this land, which was naturally adapted for wisdom and virtue; and there they implanted brave children of the soil, and put into their minds the order of government; their names are preserved, but their actions have disappeared by reason of the destruction of those who received the tradition, and the lapse of ages. For when there were any survivors, as I have already said, they were men who dwelt in the mountains; and they were ignorant of the art of writing, and had heard only the names of the chiefs of the land, but very little about their actions. The names they were willing enough to give to their children; but the virtues and the laws of their predecessors, they knew only by obscure traditions; and as they themselves and their children lacked for many generations the necessaries of life, they directed their attention to the supply of their wants, and of them they conversed, to the neglect of events that had happened in times long past; for mythology and the enquiry into antiquity are first introduced into cities when they begin to have leisure, and when they see that the necessaries of life have already been provided, but not before. And this is reason why the names of the ancients have been preserved to us and not their actions. This I infer because Solon said that the priests in their narrative of that war mentioned most of the names which are recorded prior to the time of Theseus, such as Cecrops, and Erechtheus, and Erichthonius, and Erysichthon, and the names of the women in like manner. Moreover, since military pursuits were then common to men and women, the men of those days in accordance with the custom of the time set up a figure and image of the goddess in full armour, to be a testimony that all animals which associate together, male as well as female, may, if they please, practise in common the virtue which belongs to them without distinction of sex.

Now the country was inhabited in those days by various classes of citizens;-there were artisans, and there were husbandmen, and there was also a warrior class originally set apart by divine men. The latter dwelt by themselves, and had all things suitable for nurture and education; neither had any of them anything of their own, but they regarded all that they had as common property; nor did they claim to receive of the other citizens anything more than their necessary food. And they practised all the pursuits which we yesterday described as those of our imaginary guardians. Concerning the country the Egyptian priests said what is not only probable but manifestly true, that the boundaries were in those days fixed by the Isthmus, and that in the direction of the continent they extended as far as the heights of Cithaeron and Parnes; the boundary line came down in the direction of the sea, having the district of Oropus on the right, and with the river Asopus as the limit on the left. The land was the best in the world, and was therefore able in those days to support a vast army, raised from the surrounding people. Even the remnant of Attica which now exists may compare with any region in the world for the variety and excellence of its fruits and the suitableness of its pastures to every sort of animal, which proves what I am saying; but in those days the country was fair as now and yielded far more abundant produce. How shall I establish my words? and what part of it can be truly called a remnant of the land that then was? The whole country is only a long promontory extending far into the sea away from the rest of the continent, while the surrounding basin of the sea is everywhere deep in the neighbourhood of the shore. Many great deluges have taken place during the nine thousand years, for that is the number of years which have elapsed since the time of which I am speaking; and during all this time and through so many changes, there has never been any considerable accumulation of the soil coming down from the mountains, as in other places, but the earth has fallen away all round and sunk out of sight. The consequence is, that in comparison of what then was, there are remaining only the bones of the wasted body, as they may be called, as in the case of small islands, all the richer and softer parts of the soil having fallen away, and the mere skeleton of the land being left. But in the primitive state of the country, its mountains were high hills covered with soil, and the plains, as they are termed by us, of Phelleus were full of rich earth, and there was abundance of wood in the mountains. Of this last the traces still remain, for although some of the mountains now only afford sustenance to bees, not so very long ago there were still to be seen roofs of timber cut from trees growing there, which were of a size sufficient to cover the largest houses; and there were many other high trees, cultivated by man and bearing abundance of food for cattle. Moreover, the land reaped the benefit of the annual rainfall, not as now losing the water which flows off the bare earth into the sea, but, having an abundant supply in all places, and receiving it into herself and treasuring it up in the close clay soil, it let off into the hollows the streams which it absorbed from the heights, providing everywhere abundant fountains and rivers, of which there may still be observed sacred memorials in places where fountains once existed; and this proves the truth of what I am saying.

Such was the natural state of the country, which was cultivated, as we may well believe, by true husbandmen, who made husbandry their business, and were lovers of honour, and of a noble nature, and had a soil the best in the world, and abundance of water, and in the heaven above an excellently attempered climate. Now the city in those days was arranged on this wise. In the first place the Acropolis was not as now. For the fact is that a single night of excessive rain washed away the earth and laid bare the rock; at the same time there were earthquakes, and then occurred the extraordinary inundation, which was the third before the great destruction of Deucalion. But in primitive times the hill of the Acropolis extended to the Eridanus and Ilissus, and included the Pnyx on one side, and the Lycabettus as a boundary on the opposite side to the Pnyx, and was all well covered with soil, and level at the top, except in one or two places. Outside the Acropolis and under the sides of the hill there dwelt artisans, and such of the husbandmen as were tilling the ground near; the warrior class dwelt by themselves around the temples of Athene and Hephaestus at the summit, which moreover they had enclosed with a single fence like the garden of a single house. On the north side they had dwellings in common and had erected halls for dining in winter, and had all the buildings which they needed for their common life, besides temples, but there was no adorning of them with gold and silver, for they made no use of these for any purpose; they took a middle course between meanness and ostentation, and built modest houses in which they and their children's children grew old, and they handed them down to others who were like themselves, always the same. But in summer-time they left their gardens and gymnasia and dining halls, and then the southern side of the hill was made use of by them for the same purpose. Where the Acropolis now is there was a fountain, which was choked by the earthquake, and has left only the few small streams which still exist in the vicinity, but in those days the fountain gave an abundant supply of water for all and of suitable temperature in summer and in winter. This is how they dwelt, being the guardians of their own citizens and the leaders of the Hellenes, who were their willing followers. And they took care to preserve the same number of men and women through all time, being so many as were required for warlike purposes, then as now-that is to say, about twenty thousand. Such were the ancient Athenians, and after this manner they righteously administered their own land and the rest of Hellas; they were renowned all over Europe and Asia for the beauty of their persons and for the many virtues of their souls, and of all men who lived in those days they were the most illustrious. And next, if I have not forgotten what I heard when I was a child, I will impart to you the character and origin of their adversaries. For friends should not keep their stories to themselves, but have them in common.

Yet, before proceeding further in the narrative, I ought to warn you, that you must not be surprised if you should perhaps hear Hellenic names given to foreigners. I will tell you the reason of this: Solon, who was intending to use the tale for his poem, enquired into the meaning of the names, and found that the early Egyptians in writing them down had translated them into their own language, and he recovered the meaning of the several names and when copying them out again translated them into our language. My great-grandfather, Dropides, had the original writing, which is still in my possession, and was carefully studied by me when I was a child. Therefore if you hear names such as are used in this country, you must not be surprised, for I have told how they came to be introduced. The tale, which was of great length, began as follows:-

I have before remarked in speaking of the allotments of the gods, that they distributed the whole earth into portions differing in extent, and made for themselves temples and instituted sacrifices. And Poseidon, receiving for his lot the island of Atlantis, begat children by a mortal woman, and settled them in a part of the island, which I will describe. Looking towards the sea, but in the centre of the whole island, there was a plain which is said to have been the fairest of all plains and very fertile. Near the plain again, and also in the centre of the island at a distance of about fifty stadia, there was a mountain not very high on any side.

In this mountain there dwelt one of the earth born primeval men of that country, whose name was Evenor, and he had a wife named Leucippe, and they had an only daughter who was called Cleito. The maiden had already reached womanhood, when her father and mother died; Poseidon fell in love with her and had intercourse with her, and breaking the ground, inclosed the hill in which she dwelt all round, making alternate zones of sea and land larger and smaller, encircling one another; there were two of land and three of water, which he turned as with a lathe, each having its circumference equidistant every way from the centre, so that no man could get to the island, for ships and voyages were not as yet. He himself, being a god, found no difficulty in making special arrangements for the centre island, bringing up two springs of water from beneath the earth, one of warm water and the other of cold, and making every variety of food to spring up abundantly from the soil. He also begat and brought up five pairs of twin male children; and dividing the island of Atlantis into ten portions, he gave to the first-born of the eldest pair his mother's dwelling and the surrounding allotment, which was the largest and best, and made him king over the rest; the others he made princes, and gave them rule over many men, and a large territory. And he named them all; the eldest, who was the first king, he named Atlas, and after him the whole island and the ocean were called Atlantic. To his twin brother, who was born after him, and obtained as his lot the extremity of the island towards the Pillars of Heracles, facing the country which is now called the region of Gades in that part of the world, he gave the name which in the Hellenic language is Eumelus, in the language of the country which is named after him, Gadeirus. Of the second pair of twins he called one Ampheres, and the other Evaemon. To the elder of the third pair of twins he gave the name Mneseus, and Autochthon to the one who followed him. Of the fourth pair of twins he called the elder Elasippus, and the younger Mestor. And of the fifth pair he gave to the elder the name of Azaes, and to the younger that of Diaprepes. All these and their descendants for many generations were the inhabitants and rulers of divers islands in the open sea; and also, as has been already said, they held sway in our direction over the country within the Pillars as far as Egypt and Tyrrhenia.

Now Atlas had a numerous and honourable family, and they retained the kingdom, the eldest son handing it on to his eldest for many generations; and they had such an amount of wealth as was never before possessed by kings and potentates, and is not likely ever to be again, and they were furnished with everything which they needed, both in the city and country. For because of the greatness of their empire many things were brought to them from foreign countries, and the island itself provided most of what was required by them for the uses of life. In the first place, they dug out of the earth whatever was to be found there, solid as well as fusile, and that which is now only a name and was then something more than a name, orichalcum, was dug out of the earth in many parts of the island, being more precious in those days than anything except gold. There was an abundance of wood for carpenter's work, and sufficient maintenance for tame and wild animals. Moreover, there were a great number of elephants in the island; for as there was provision for all other sorts of animals, both for those which live in lakes and marshes and rivers, and also for those which live in mountains and on plains, so there was for the animal which is the largest and most voracious of all. Also whatever fragrant things there now are in the earth, whether roots, or herbage, or woods, or essences which distil from fruit and flower, grew and thrived in that land; also the fruit which admits of cultivation, both the dry sort, which is given us for nourishment and any other which we use for food-we call them all by the common name pulse, and the fruits having a hard rind, affording drinks and meats and ointments, and good store of chestnuts and the like, which furnish pleasure and amusement, and are fruits which spoil with keeping, and the pleasant kinds of dessert, with which we console ourselves after dinner, when we are tired of eating-all these that sacred island which then beheld the light of the sun, brought forth fair and wondrous and in infinite abundance. With such blessings the earth freely furnished them; meanwhile they went on constructing their temples and palaces and harbours and docks. And they arranged the whole country in the following manner:

First of all they bridged over the zones of sea which surrounded the ancient metropolis, making a road to and from the royal palace. And at the very beginning they built the palace in the habitation of the god and of their ancestors, which they continued to ornament in successive generations, every king surpassing the one who went before him to the utmost of his power, until they made the building a marvel to behold for size and for beauty. And beginning from the sea they bored a canal of three hundred feet in width and one hundred feet in depth and fifty stadia in length, which they carried through to the outermost zone, making a passage from the sea up to this, which became a harbour, and leaving an opening sufficient to enable the largest vessels to find ingress. Moreover, they divided at the bridges the zones of land which parted the zones of sea, leaving room for a single trireme to pass out of one zone into another, and they covered over the channels so as to leave a way underneath for the ships; for the banks were raised considerably above the water. Now the largest of the zones into which a passage was cut from the sea was three stadia in breadth, and the zone of land which came next of equal breadth; but the next two zones, the one of water, the other of land, were two stadia, and the one which surrounded the central island was a stadium only in width. The island in which the palace was situated had a diameter of five stadia. All this including the zones and the bridge, which was the sixth part of a stadium in width, they surrounded by a stone wall on every side, placing towers and gates on the bridges where the sea passed in. The stone which was used in the work they quarried from underneath the centre island, and from underneath the zones, on the outer as well as the inner side. One kind was white, another black, and a third red, and as they quarried, they at the same time hollowed out double docks, having roofs formed out of the native rock. Some of their buildings were simple, but in others they put together different stones, varying the colour to please the eye, and to be a natural source of delight. The entire circuit of the wall, which went round the outermost zone, they covered with a coating of brass, and the circuit of the next wall they coated with tin, and the third, which encompassed the citadel, flashed with the red light of orichalcum.

The palaces in the interior of the citadel were constructed on this wise:-in the centre was a holy temple dedicated to Cleito and Poseidon, which remained inaccessible, and was surrounded by an enclosure of gold; this was the spot where the family of the ten princes first saw the light, and thither the people annually brought the fruits of the earth in their season from all the ten portions, to be an offering to each of the ten. Here was Poseidon's own temple which was a stadium in length, and half a stadium in width, and of a proportionate height, having a strange barbaric appearance. All the outside of the temple, with the exception of the pinnacles, they covered with silver, and the pinnacles with gold. In the interior of the temple the roof was of ivory, curiously wrought everywhere with gold and silver and orichalcum; and all the other parts, the walls and pillars and floor, they coated with orichalcum. In the temple they placed statues of gold: there was the god himself standing in a chariot-the charioteer of six winged horses-and of such a size that he touched the roof of the building with his head; around him there were a hundred Nereids riding on dolphins, for such was thought to be the number of them by the men of those days. There were also in the interior of the temple other images which had been dedicated by private persons. And around the temple on the outside were placed statues of gold of all the descendants of the ten kings and of their wives, and there were many other great offerings of kings and of private persons, coming both from the city itself and from the foreign cities over which they held sway. There was an altar too, which in size and workmanship corresponded to this magnificence, and the palaces, in like manner, answered to the greatness of the kingdom and the glory of the temple.

In the next place, they had fountains, one of cold and another of hot water, in gracious plenty flowing; and they were wonderfully adapted for use by reason of the pleasantness and excellence of their waters. They constructed buildings about them and planted suitable trees, also they made cisterns, some open to the heavens, others roofed over, to be used in winter as warm baths; there were the kings' baths, and the baths of private persons, which were kept apart; and there were separate baths for women, and for horses and cattle, and to each of them they gave as much adornment as was suitable. Of the water which ran off they carried some to the grove of Poseidon, where were growing all manner of trees of wonderful height and beauty, owing to the excellence of the soil, while the remainder was conveyed by aqueducts along the bridges to the outer circles; and there were many temples built and dedicated to many gods; also gardens and places of exercise, some for men, and others for horses in both of the two islands formed by the zones; and in the centre of the larger of the two there was set apart a race-course of a stadium in width, and in length allowed to extend all round the island, for horses to race in. Also there were guardhouses at intervals for the guards, the more trusted of whom were appointed-to keep watch in the lesser zone, which was nearer the Acropolis while the most trusted of all had houses given them within the citadel, near the persons of the kings. The docks were full of triremes and naval stores, and all things were quite ready for use. Enough of the plan of the royal palace.

Leaving the palace and passing out across the three you came to a wall which began at the sea and went all round: this was everywhere distant fifty stadia from the largest zone or harbour, and enclosed the whole, the ends meeting at the mouth of the channel which led to the sea. The entire area was densely crowded with habitations; and the canal and the largest of the harbours were full of vessels and merchants coming from all parts, who, from their numbers, kept up a multitudinous sound of human voices, and din and clatter of all sorts night and day.

I have described the city and the environs of the ancient palace nearly in the words of Solon, and now I must endeavour to represent the nature and arrangement of the rest of the land. The whole country was said by him to be very lofty and precipitous on the side of the sea, but the country immediately about and surrounding the city was a level plain, itself surrounded by mountains which descended towards the sea; it was smooth and even, and of an oblong shape, extending in one direction three thousand stadia, but across the centre inland it was two thousand stadia. This part of the island looked towards the south, and was sheltered from the north. The surrounding mountains were celebrated for their number and size and beauty, far beyond any which still exist, having in them also many wealthy villages of country folk, and rivers, and lakes, and meadows supplying food enough for every animal, wild or tame, and much wood of various sorts, abundant for each and every kind of work.

I will now describe the plain, as it was fashioned by nature and by the labours of many generations of kings through long ages. It was for the most part rectangular and oblong, and where falling out of the straight line followed the circular ditch. The depth, and width, and length of this ditch were incredible, and gave the impression that a work of such extent, in addition to so many others, could never have been artificial. Nevertheless I must say what I was told. It was excavated to the depth of a hundred, feet, and its breadth was a stadium everywhere; it was carried round the whole of the plain, and was ten thousand stadia in length. It received the streams which came down from the mountains, and winding round the plain and meeting at the city, was there let off into the sea. Further inland, likewise, straight canals of a hundred feet in width were cut from it through the plain, and again let off into the ditch leading to the sea: these canals were at intervals of a hundred stadia, and by them they brought down the wood from the mountains to the city, and conveyed the fruits of the earth in ships, cutting transverse passages from one canal into another, and to the city. Twice in the year they gathered the fruits of the earth-in winter having the benefit of the rains of heaven, and in summer the water which the land supplied by introducing streams from the canals.

As to the population, each of the lots in the plain had to find a leader for the men who were fit for military service, and the size of a lot was a square of ten stadia each way, and the total number of all the lots was sixty thousand. And of the inhabitants of the mountains and of the rest of the country there was also a vast multitude, which was distributed among the lots and had leaders assigned to them according to their districts and villages. The leader was required to furnish for the war the sixth portion of a war-chariot, so as to make up a total of ten thousand chariots; also two horses and riders for them, and a pair of chariot-horses without a seat, accompanied by a horseman who could fight on foot carrying a small shield, and having a charioteer who stood behind the man-at-arms to guide the two horses; also, he was bound to furnish two heavy armed soldiers, two slingers, three stone-shooters and three javelin-men, who were light-armed, and four sailors to make up the complement of twelve hundred ships. Such was the military order of the royal city-the order of the other nine governments varied, and it would be wearisome to recount their several differences.

As to offices and honours, the following was the arrangement from the first. Each of the ten kings in his own division and in his own city had the absolute control of the citizens, and, in most cases, of the laws, punishing and slaying whomsoever he would. Now the order of precedence among them and their mutual relations were regulated by the commands of Poseidon which the law had handed down. These were inscribed by the first kings on a pillar of orichalcum, which was situated in the middle of the island, at the temple of Poseidon, whither the kings were gathered together every fifth and every sixth year alternately, thus giving equal honour to the odd and to the even number. And when they were gathered together they consulted about their common interests, and enquired if any one had transgressed in anything and passed judgment and before they passed judgment they gave their pledges to one another on this wise:-There were bulls who had the range of the temple of Poseidon; and the ten kings, being left alone in the temple, after they had offered prayers to the god that they might capture the victim which was acceptable to him, hunted the bulls, without weapons but with staves and nooses; and the bull which they caught they led up to the pillar and cut its throat over the top of it so that the blood fell upon the sacred inscription. Now on the pillar, besides the laws, there was inscribed an oath invoking mighty curses on the disobedient. When therefore, after slaying the bull in the accustomed manner, they had burnt its limbs, they filled a bowl of wine and cast in a clot of blood for each of them; the rest of the victim they put in the fire, after having purified the column all round. Then they drew from the bowl in golden cups and pouring a libation on the fire, they swore that they would judge according to the laws on the pillar, and would punish him who in any point had already transgressed them, and that for the future they would not, if they could help, offend against the writing on the pillar, and would neither command others, nor obey any ruler who commanded them, to act otherwise than according to the laws of their father Poseidon. This was the prayer which each of them-offered up for himself and for his descendants, at the same time drinking and dedicating the cup out of which he drank in the temple of the god; and after they had supped and satisfied their needs, when darkness came on, and the fire about the sacrifice was cool, all of them put on most beautiful azure robes, and, sitting on the ground, at night, over the embers of the sacrifices by which they had sworn, and extinguishing all the fire about the temple, they received and gave judgment, if any of them had an accusation to bring against any one; and when they given judgment, at daybreak they wrote down their sentences on a golden tablet, and dedicated it together with their robes to be a memorial.

There were many special laws affecting the several kings inscribed about the temples, but the most important was the following: They were not to take up arms against one another, and they were all to come to the rescue if any one in any of their cities attempted to overthrow the royal house; like their ancestors, they were to deliberate in common about war and other matters, giving the supremacy to the descendants of Atlas. And the king was not to have the power of life and death over any of his kinsmen unless he had the assent of the majority of the ten.

Such was the vast power which the god settled in the lost island of Atlantis; and this he afterwards directed against our land for the following reasons, as tradition tells: For many generations, as long as the divine nature lasted in them, they were obedient to the laws, and well-affectioned towards the god, whose seed they were; for they possessed true and in every way great spirits, uniting gentleness with wisdom in the various chances of life, and in their intercourse with one another. They despised everything but virtue, caring little for their present state of life, and thinking lightly of the possession of gold and other property, which seemed only a burden to them; neither were they intoxicated by luxury; nor did wealth deprive them of their self-control; but they were sober, and saw clearly that all these goods are increased by virtue and friendship with one another, whereas by too great regard and respect for them, they are lost and friendship with them. By such reflections and by the continuance in them of a divine nature, the qualities which we have described grew and increased among them; but when the divine portion began to fade away, and became diluted too often and too much with the mortal admixture, and the human nature got the upper hand, they then, being unable to bear their fortune, behaved unseemly, and to him who had an eye to see grew visibly debased, for they were losing the fairest of their precious gifts; but to those who had no eye to see the true happiness, they appeared glorious and blessed at the very time when they were full of avarice and unrighteous power. Zeus, the god of gods, who rules according to law, and is able to see into such things, perceiving that an honourable race was in a woeful plight, and wanting to inflict punishment on them, that they might be chastened and improve, collected all the gods into their most holy habitation, which, being placed in the centre of the world, beholds all created things. And when he had called them together, he spake as follows - * .....

Yep, that's where it cuts off! It's painful.....



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Post by Jonathan28 Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:51 pm

_____________________

The Storyteller
_____________________

Plato, also known as Aristocles, was born in Athens approx 427 - 428BC, and died peacefully in 347BC at around 80 years of age. He was a respected Greek philosopher, and a student of Socrates, the Grandfather of Western Philosophy. When Socrates was executed in Athens in 399BC, Plato was deeply affected and spent several years travelling and learning, before returning to Athens at age 40 to set up a school of philosophy, which remained in operation for over 900 years (until the Christians closed it down suspecting it would undermine their religion). It's most famous student was Aristotle.

For more info on Plato, click here to view his page on Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plato

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Where was Atlantis ?
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This is where the believers are divided.

None of the explanations put forward by Atlantologists stay 100% true to Plato's description. Major pieces of his description are often conveniently overlooked so that a researcher's particular theory makes more sense. For example, the location of Atlantis is quite clearly described by Plato, but researchers have nonetheless "found" Atlantis pretty much everywhere else.
Here are a few of the proposed locations, and the books written about them:
(You can get the basic idea of each theory by reading the blurb on the back cover or reading the reviews)


Antarctica : " The Atlantis Blueprint " by Colin Wilson and Rand Flem-Ath

Thera : " " by Charles R. Pellegrino

Thera : " "

Thera : " " by Walter L. Friedrich, translated by Alexander R. McBirney

Cyprus : " " by Robert Sarmast

Central America : " " by Ivar Zapp & George Erikson

Central America : " " by Lewis Spence & Paul Tice



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Theories on the Destruction
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The most popular theories as to the destruction of Atlantis are exactly what Plato described, earthquakes and floods. The floods more than likely attributable to the tidal waves that would have been caused by the earthquakes.

Another theory is that there was a volcano on the island that errupted with such force that the island was buried in molten lava.

Yet another theory is that an asteroid hit the Island, exerting the destructive power of hundreds of atomic bombs.

Someone has even put forward the idea that Atlantis was purposely flooded by extra terrestrials in an attempt to kill some rebels of their own planet who fled here to Earth and landed in Atlantis, where they interbred with humans... @_@


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Reason to Doubt
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Many experts believe that Plato, being a master storyteller, created the story of Atlantis to illustrate a philosophical point; that a perfect society was corrupted and became greedy, waged war on their neighbours, and were then divinely punished for it.

Could he have been imagining what may happen to his own home of Athens if it didn't check itself and it's people soon? A warning perhaps to the Athenian leaders that they may be heading down the same path of greed and corruption, so much so as to warrant them all a similar divine punishment?

Some of the details in Plato's description are the story's own worst enemies in some ways. The biggest problem is the date given to the destruction of Atlantis, which is around 9,600BC. For there to have been a race that technologically advanced at that particular time would re-write our known history of our own species, because human civilization as we would think of it has only been around since about 5000BC.

To be more precise, in 9,600BC our species are thought to have still been hunter-gatherers. The earliest city that we have evidence of is from about 8000BC called Catalhoyuk, in Turkey, and it is much more primitive than what Plato describes. Also Plato talks of domesticated cattle, and the earliest evidence researchers have found of domesticated cattle is 6,000BC. The architecture that Plato speaks of is far more advanced than what researchers believe would have been in use at that time, as more sophisticated buildings didn't start to show up until around 5,000BC at the very earliest. In fact there is almost no archaeological evidence that could support the claim that a society such as that described by Plato would have existed at the time stated.

On the other hand, there was no actual date given by the Egyptian Priest who first spoke of Atlantis to Solon, what he said was that it existed 9,000 years ago.

Some have theorised that the Egyptian Priest was actually referring to years in the sense of the ancient Egyptian lunar calendar where a year was actually a month. This may have confused people in the retelling of it in Greece because the Greek calendar was similar to our own, with 9000 years being 9000 years. ( I'm not really sure of the specifics of the lunar calendar, and the 1 month = 1 year, so don't quote me! )
But if this was the case, it would set the year of the destruction of Atlantis at a much more acceptable date, say between 1000 - 1500 BC.

Many believe that Plato was basing his account of Atlantis on the history of the Minoan civilization, which would coincide well with these new dates. The history of the Minoan civilization and the description of Atlantis have a suspicious amount in common at any rate.


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Recent Discoveries
and other supporting evidence.
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Why can we find the same plants and animal species on continents that are thousands of miles apart from each other?
If Atlantis existed in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean, it would have served as a land bridge between these continents, allowing the animals and plants (via the animals) to migrate between. Experts in many different fields of research, not Atlantis experts, have stated that they think there must have been a land mass connecting the continents together somehow.
In the Timaeus dialogue, Plato said Atlantis was "the way to other islands, and from these you might pass to the whole of the opposite continent".

Also, can it be mere coincidence that several ancient cultures seem to have spontaneously acquired certain knowledge and skills that were seemingly beyond their level of development at the time? The ability to build a perfect pyramid for example, this skill could not have been developed by several different cultures independantly of eachother in such a short period of time. One theory is that they inherited this knowlegde from a previous culture.
The Atlanteans were said to possess advanced skills and knowledge, particularly of engineering, consider the sophisticated irrigation systems and the canals as described by Plato. It is a possibility that the Atlanteans were the original pyramid builders, and they shared their knowledge with their neighbours. The pyramids are extremely sophisticated structures, often built so that their angles align perfectly with constellations in the heavens or with perfect north south east and west.
German Author Erich von Däniken believes these coincidences are attributable to "ancient astronauts", aliens who visited Earth in ancient times and shared techonologies with the ancient people. And a lot of people believe that the inhabitants of Atlantis were in fact aliens. They were said to be taller than the average person, more beautiful, etc.
There have been suggestions they may have been aliens fleeing their own recently destroyed planet (Mars has been implicated), and they landed on earth and colonized Atlantis. There are many bizarre theories..

The renowned American psychic Edgar Cayce ( 1877 - 1945 ) conducted "readings" on thousands of people in his time, often talking to them about their previous lives. Some of the people he interviewed had, in a previous life, lived in Atlantis, and from these people he collected some unbelievably detailed descriptions of the place.
Cayce also made many predictions, a couple assosciated with Atlantis. The most interesting and exciting of these Atlantis predictions is this :

"A portion of the temples may yet be discovered under the slime of ages and sea water near Bimini... Expect it in '68 or '69 - not so far away."

Sure enough, in 1968 (some 23 years after Cayce's own death) the Bimini Road was discovered in less than 15 feet of water on the floor of the Atlantic Ocean, at North Bimini Island in the Bahamas. The Bimini Road is a half mile long road of perfectly aligned limestone rocks, most spectacular when viewed from the air. Some skeptics believe that these rocks are a natural formation, and not man-made. But now, thanks to new evidence uncovered at the area, many experts disagree.
Have a look at the images below and draw your own conclusions.

What the stones look like from an aerial view:-

https://i.servimg.com/u/f49/17/09/37/78/at_bim11.jpg

https://i.servimg.com/u/f49/17/09/37/78/at_bim12.jpg

Underwater photos of the Bimini Road:-

https://i.servimg.com/u/f49/17/09/37/78/at_bmr10.jpg

https://i.servimg.com/u/f49/17/09/37/78/at_bmr11.jpg

https://i.servimg.com/u/f49/17/09/37/78/at_bmr12.jpg

https://i.servimg.com/u/f49/17/09/37/78/at_bmr13.jpg

https://i.servimg.com/u/f49/17/09/37/78/at_bmr14.jpg

https://i.servimg.com/u/f49/17/09/37/78/at_bmr15.jpg

It is most intriguing that this site was "discovered" exactly when and where Edgar Cayce had predicted Atlantis to rise. An extraordinary coincidence?

Where does the Bimini Road lead? It descends into the sand and nobody knows how far down it actually goes.
Is "road" even a correct description? It would appear not. In the last few years intense research has been done in the area to try to uncover the mystery of these stones.
Dr. Greg Little, a Psychologist and Prehistorian, and esteemed author of over 30 books (including "Edgar Cayce's Atlantis ") has lead the research team, and has made some amazing discoveries. The most startling is that beneath the gigantic and seemingly precisely placed stones, is another layer of stones, exactly the same. This discovery would tend to suggest that it is not a road at all, but perhaps a wall. And it makes the argument a lot tougher for the skeptics who believe it to be a natural formation!
Greg Little's team has uncovered markings on some of the rocks that seem to to be deliberately carved holes or tool marks. They have also found what appear to be anchors from ancient ships, on which tests are still being conducted to determine the the era that they may be from.
While Dr. Little is not convinced that it is the site of Atlantis, he is convinced that it was an ancient shipping dock, but to which civilization it belonged is unclear. The design of the ship docks, if indeed that is what they are, resemble ancient docks of Cuba, Asia, and parts of Africa.
Even if Dr Little is not convinced, the Bimini Road is believed by many to be part of the ruins of Atlantis.





On the opposite side of the Atlantic Ocean from Bimini, another location has recently been investigated as a possible candidate for the remains of Atlantis. Spartel Island, now just a mud shoal submerged 60 metres underwater, lies just west of the Straights of Gibraltar (known in ancient times as the pillars of Heracles / Hercules). It is in the exact place that Plato described Atlantis to have existed.


"There was an island situated in front of the Pillars of Hercules; the island was larger than Libya and Asia put together," it was "the way to other islands, and from these you might pass to the whole of the opposite continent".

Geological evidence collected at the site of Spartel Island confirms the island was ravaged by earthquakes and tsunamis around 11,600 years ago.
The exact place, the exact time, the exact conditions.
But the man responsible for the most recent research expeditions at this site, Marc-Andre Gutscher, has seemingly given up hope. At the recent conference in Milos regarding Atlantis he seems to have become discouraged upon hearing the arguments put forward by some of the other experts, who stressed that a civilization such as that which Plato described could not possibly have existed in 9,600BC....


Last edited by Ordinho10 on Tue Jan 24, 2012 3:15 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Post by Jonathan28 Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:54 pm

_____________________

Author's Thoughts
_____________________ .



While I am no expert on the theories about Atlantis, I am an enthusiastic lover of mysterious things and places, and Atlantis has intrigued me and inspired me since the first time I heard of it.
I have a lot more reading to do on the subject, as there is a wealth of books available and many many theories that have been put forward, and perhaps after more research I may feel differently about it all. But at the moment, as I write this, I believe the most exciting possibilities for the location of Atlantis to be the area of Bimini and the Bimini Road in the Bahamas, or the recently investigated site of Spartel Island, as described above. I can only hope that Marc Andre Gutsher or some other researcher decides someday to continue the search there.


With our technology advancing in leaps and bounds, we have never stood a better chance of finding Atlantis than we do now. And It may be our generation that finds it, after 11,600 years.
So get out there and look people!

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I don't know about you guys, but this really changed my view on the matter, it may be because I have the ability to see things from other people's view unlike most, but it makes sense, and he has evidence, and does not come across as much of a dick as the Skepdic people.






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Post by Jonathan28 Tue Jan 24, 2012 3:16 pm

Sorry about the size of the pictures, here's the website link, go down he page and you'll see them.

http://unxplained-factor.com/atlantis.htm
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Post by free_cat Wed Feb 15, 2012 3:45 pm

We have almost all the world mapped and scanned, even google earthed. The depths of the sea have been thoroughly explored. I don't rule completely out the existence of the Atlantis, but the evidence of its none existence is appalling to the date.
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Post by VivaStPauli Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:51 pm

Atlantis. Is. Made. Up. By. Plato.

He used it to prove a point.
Come on people! He even says that the Atlantean civilization waged war against Athens around 9000BC - even if Athens had already existed by then, they would've been primitive people, considering we have no historical accounts of a Greek civilization in that time.

That alone should make it obvious that he made it up, yet I'd still make it simpler than that and point to Occams Razor. There's just no reason to assume Atlantis was real, when the only accounts of it come from Platon, who himself wrote that it isn't a real place. :coffee:
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Post by VivaStPauli Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:52 pm

Also, free_cat, technically we haven't explored the depths of the sea all that thoroughly - I don't think we'll find Atlantis either, because the bottom of the ocean is pretty well mapped, we just don't know what lives there yet.
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Post by Jonathan28 Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:55 pm

VivaStPauli wrote:Also, free_cat, technically we haven't explored the depths of the sea all that thoroughly - I don't think we'll find Atlantis either, because the bottom of the ocean is pretty well mapped, we just don't know what lives there yet.

I was going to reply with this but you got here before me, we havenot in any way or form explored all the depths of the ocean yet, mostly becuase we do not have the technology able to sustain the pressure that is created that deep but because it costs money. If Atlantis ever existed it would be way down in the bottom of the ocean, it will take awhile for us to be able to get down there to check for sure.

Damn, distracted from work again :facepalm:
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Post by VivaStPauli Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:03 pm

Things like Atlantis, we would've found though, because we can map ocean floor elevation with satellites, it's just that we can't physically go down there and have an actual look - but that's just a problem when trying to find monster squid, not when you try to find Atlantis.
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Post by Senor Penguin Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:07 pm

Atlantis stories always remind me of Yonaguni.

Take a peep, if you will:
http://www.robertschoch.com/yonagunicontent.html

It's a work of nature but still interesting nonetheless.

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Post by Jonathan28 Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:10 pm

VivaStPauli wrote:Things like Atlantis, we would've found though, because we can map ocean floor elevation with satellites, it's just that we can't physically go down there and have an actual look - but that's just a problem when trying to find monster squid, not when you try to find Atlantis.

Wouldn't it be impossible because Atlantis would have been utterly destroyed? Just imagine Britian being hit by earthquakes and tsunami's, every building being disintigrated and eventually disappearing into the depths of the North sea, nevermind that its not as deep as the Atlantic or the Pacific. Good luck finding any of it with satellite after a couple of thousand years, you would have to go down there personally and look for any evidence of broken structures.
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