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Post by eelir on Mon Mar 25, 2019 8:42 am

Dembele is ok lately and should be good if he stays fit, but please do not compare him with Mbappe, he might even surpass him at some point, but right now they are not at the same level - regardless if you take injury or his poor decision making (which only blind people will not notice he has) into account.
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Post by Myesyats on Mon Mar 25, 2019 9:31 am

@Mr Nick09 wrote:dembele is about the same level as Mbappe? Laughing if dembele had 10% of mbappe football IQ he would be a top 5 player lol, not even close.

Yeah lol just because you're a fanboy of the turtle doesn't mean Dembele isn't quality. He's a difference maker. Both players are great in their own way, but about the same level nonetheless. Theres no point in debating that because I know personal preference might cloud you judgement.
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Post by futbol on Mon Mar 25, 2019 7:32 pm

Washed up Di Maria has double digit goals and assists in Ligue 1. Dembélé would be a huge star there if he played for PSG and there would be constant debates who is better between him and Mbappe.

He is constantly injured so it doesn't help his development plus we play differently to any other club in the world so adapting as a winger is really hard. I don't even remember when we had a true winger playing for us the last time. Neymar, Villa, Pedro, Henry, Eto'o, Ronaldinho, younger Messi. All of them are strikers/forwards/wingforwards/all-around forwards but not out-and-out wingers. What's a winger going to do with little counterattacking and 2 banks of 4 infont of him all the time? He is actually a misfit for us unless we slowly move away from what we used to do in the past 20 or so years (which we should, because that style only works with GOAT players, otherwise you become LVG's Manchester United or Arsenal or pre and post Xaviesta "quarter final" Spain).

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Tue Mar 26, 2019 8:50 pm

I have recently been reminded to be polite to other people, so instead of saying that your opinion is horseshit, I will say this:

Dear Myesyats,

I respect that you may have a different opinion that me. However, often when players are compared, people assume that we are looking at black or white situation, when the gaps are actually not that significant. However there is clear distinction between a player who is one of the 5 best in world and the rest. Actually I will go further in saying that there is a pretty big gap between players like CR Messi and the rest.

Dembele is a very fine footballer, unpredictable, highly proficient technically and  extremely fast. However there is a level that he simply won't reach if he doesn't improve his decision making on the pitch. I am talking about straight up conversion of talent to performance, which includes showing up on time to training.

Mbappe as a point of reference, excluding the two alien that I mentioned, is at the top of the food chain when it comes to this aspect of the game for an attacking player

So if after watching Mbappe taking over the champions league by storm at 18, terrorizing CL and Ligue 1 defenders, and winning France a world Cup, you still reach the conclusion that Dembele is at the same level as Mbappe, and does as much on the field to convert his talent to onfield succes, then the only conclusion I can reach is that you are sincerely deluded, and your opinion on this topic is shit.

Big kisses

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Post by Lucifer on Wed Mar 27, 2019 3:13 am

@Mr Nick09 wrote:I have recently been reminded to be polite to other people, so instead of saying that your opinion is horseshit, I will say this:

Dear Myesyats,

I respect that you may have a different opinion that me. However, often when players are compared, people assume that we are looking at black or white situation, when the gaps are actually not that significant. However there is clear distinction between a player who is one of the 5 best in world and the rest. Actually I will go further in saying that there is a pretty big gap between players like CR Messi and the rest.

Dembele is a very fine footballer, unpredictable, highly proficient technically and  extremely fast. However there is a level that he simply won't reach if he doesn't improve his decision making on the pitch. I am talking about straight up conversion of talent to performance, which includes showing up on time to training.

Mbappe as a point of reference, excluding the two alien that I mentioned, is at the top of the food chain when it comes to this aspect of the game for an attacking player

So if after watching Mbappe taking over the champions league by storm at 18, terrorizing CL and Ligue 1 defenders, and winning France a world Cup, you still reach the conclusion that Dembele is at the same level as Mbappe, and does as much on the field to convert his talent to onfield succes, then the only conclusion I can reach is that you are sincerely deluded, and your opinion on this topic is shit.

Big kisses

Your opinion is horseshit. And stop kissing random strangers you perv.
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Post by Mr Nick09 on Wed Mar 27, 2019 8:37 am

Myesyats whom i affectionally nicknamed mystats is clearly not a stranger, big kisses too you devil

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Post by Myesyats on Wed Mar 27, 2019 9:38 am

He's not fully converting his talent into performance because he's been struggling with injuries. Fully fit, Dembele is unplayable. And that's the point. Your main argument is that his decision making is lacking but that's just plainly untrue, you must have seen clips not full games. I don't even like Dembele or at least didnt like him at first but I've seen him fully fit and I know what he's capable of. Obviously Mbappe has been more fortunate and is more successful as of now but that's not the point.
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Post by alexjanosik on Thu Mar 28, 2019 2:36 am

@Mr Nick09 wrote:I have recently been reminded to be polite to other people, so instead of saying that your opinion is horseshit, I will say this:

Dear Myesyats,

I respect that you may have a different opinion that me. However, often when players are compared, people assume that we are looking at black or white situation, when the gaps are actually not that significant. However there is clear distinction between a player who is one of the 5 best in world and the rest. Actually I will go further in saying that there is a pretty big gap between players like CR Messi and the rest.

Dembele is a very fine footballer, unpredictable, highly proficient technically and  extremely fast. However there is a level that he simply won't reach if he doesn't improve his decision making on the pitch. I am talking about straight up conversion of talent to performance, which includes showing up on time to training.

Mbappe as a point of reference, excluding the two alien that I mentioned, is at the top of the food chain when it comes to this aspect of the game for an attacking player

So if after watching Mbappe taking over the champions league by storm at 18, terrorizing CL and Ligue 1 defenders, and winning France a world Cup, you still reach the conclusion that Dembele is at the same level as Mbappe, and does as much on the field to convert his talent to onfield succes, then the only conclusion I can reach is that you are sincerely deluded, and your opinion on this topic is shit.

Big kisses


Mbappe is not one of the top 5 players in the world. Or did I misconstrue?
I also disagree that Dembele has poor decision making. In fact, I think he generally makes good decisions. This is typically a generic statement used against young talented players. Dembele's decision making is just fine. His season has been stop and start because of injuries but the kid has been a difference maker whenever he has played, including in the CL second leg against Lyon.
Either way, I dont think there is a gulf between the two as you claim. Mbappe has been more fortunate with injuries. Lets pick up this conversation when Dembele manages to shake off injuries.

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Post by Mr Nick09 on Thu Mar 28, 2019 3:11 am

It doesn't just come down to injuries, but here is where we are. you guys are talking about "IF" while i am talking about facts, things which have happened, stages that Mbappe has dominated and Dembele has clearly not.

there is a gulf between both that Dembele will never breach, because he is not that level of player. and yes, i state this as a matter of fact as well, Mbappe is one of the 5 best players in the world, you have the two monsters, and Mbappe. make up the rest of the top 5 with whomever

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Post by Myesyats on Thu Mar 28, 2019 8:56 am

so Ronaldo is better than Messi because he won 1 cl more and Euros? we are talking about pure individual quality, not taking into account the environment they are in.

but yeah lets agree to disagree.
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Post by Hapless_Hans on Thu Mar 28, 2019 10:06 am

I don't think anyone can disagree that Mbappe has had the (even) more impressive career so far from the two of them, and that Nick is right that in terms of consistent conversion of talent into performance, Mbappe is clearly above Dembélé at the moment.
He is also a year younger, which makes his level of consistency and of quality performances even more impressive.

Nick is always arguing against rating player too much on 'potential' and towards focusing on real performances that have already happened.

And I think he's generally right in reminding us of that, it's an important guideline to follow IMO.
In the case Dembélé vs Mbappé too, yes, the factual level of consistent performances mean that we can't say Dembélé is as good a player as Mbappé, at the moment.

Both emerged in the same season, couple of years ago, and if you look in the respective Dembélé thread, you'll find me enthusiatically posting about Dembélé, as I watched Dortmund, that he was the most spectacular talent I've seen in ages.
It was only a bit later that I caught a number of Mbappé's performances at Monaco (naturally I watch BVB more than Monaco), and then I wrote that Mbappé might be even more impressive due to his unreal maturity and consistency at an even younger age.
That has proven true.

Now you know me and you know to believe me when I say this is not a slight on Dembélé at all.
Both are unbelievable, outrageous talents that we as football fans can only be thankful that they even exist.
These are the players that provide the spice, the fun, the extra quality in world football, and they are rare enough that we shouldn't bother too much with negativity or playing them one off another.

I remain a massive, massive Dembélé fanboy as I think, his sheer unpredictable explosiveness, his ingenious, two-footed, chaotic way of playing, is just fucking awesome and yes, can make a game-winning difference any moment. I just absolute love watching him play.
And for all the injuries he's had, he's been very, very influential already in this Barca team when he's played. Even his haters can't deny that. I'm just happy to see that fans like @Myesyats are coming around to a positive outlook on this unique, special little player, and I hope his injury fortunes improve as I want to see more of him.

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Post by BarcaLearning on Sat Mar 30, 2019 11:37 am

Not joining the debate or anything, but personally I do rate Mbappe like one of the greats if he continues his way obviously. Dembele has everyone knows has he huge strengths, but also weaknesses which he has kept improving, although slower than us fans would hope. Pretty sure Mbappe will always be a bit better than Dembele overall, unless Dembele unlocks something and really makes big improvements in the weaknesses of his game. May be asking too much though, since he is amongst the best players in the world.

Would be interesting to see how they continue to evolve with the NT too, if they eventually start and play together.
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Post by Myesyats on Sat Mar 30, 2019 1:27 pm

I do think Mbappe is better, my claim however is that the gap between them isn't that significant. Which is at least more true of a statement than saying they're nowhere near in quality.
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Post by Mr Nick09 on Sat Mar 30, 2019 1:56 pm

Your argument to me seems to be that talent wise they are not far apart, maybe that's true. If you even want to argue that Dembele has more raw talent, I might not disagree with you. But talent in the grand scheme of things is irrelevant.

However, in terms of what they have achieved career wise so far with their performances, it's night and day, the gap is huge. One is walking the path of the greatests and the other is showing up late to training because he spent the night playing fortnite and Fifa.

Like I said the straight conversion of ability to performance on the pitch from Mbappe is positively insane. Good luck to Dembele doing the same. I have seen greater "talents" fail that part of the game so very often. I don't even understand why you think he will for sure get there and this is the problem, your hopes for him are somewhat discounting that Mbappe is actually performing a lot better.

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Post by eelir on Sun Mar 31, 2019 7:48 am

@Mr Nick09 wrote:Your argument to me seems to be that talent wise they are not far apart, maybe that's true. If you even want to argue that Dembele has more raw talent, I might not disagree with you. But talent in the grand scheme of things is irrelevant.

However, in terms of what they have achieved career wise so far with their performances, it's night and day, the gap is huge. One is walking the path of the greatests and the other is showing up late to training because he spent the night playing fortnite and Fifa.

Like I said the straight conversion of ability to performance on the pitch from Mbappe is positively insane. Good luck to Dembele doing the same. I have seen greater "talents" fail that part of the game so very often. I don't even understand why you think he will for sure get there and this is the problem, your hopes for him are somewhat discounting that Mbappe is actually performing a lot better.


Exactly, but I would not also say with certainty that Dembele might not surpass him in future (not likely, but not impossible also).
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Post by windkick on Mon Apr 01, 2019 12:22 am

I agree with Nick and Hans.

Dembele is incredible, and I am too lazy to look but I think you could argue he is the without a doubt the best winger at his age (21). He's fast, can dribble, is 2 footed, has proven this season to step up and be clutch when needed and has improved his goal scoring. And more importantly than anything, his main threat is and has always been his ability to create chances. Hard to find another 21 year, if any, that has that sort of foundation to build upon.

That said Mpabbe, at 20, even with all his trophies removed and just look at talent, is without a doubt not only the best forward (striker/CF) at his age but also now one of the top players not named Messi/Ronaldo on the planet and has everything it takes to get in that twosome group no other player has been able to reach in the past decade. He could not improve beyond what he is now, and would still easily be in that world class top elite tier talent that's a tier above Dembele's. Rashford is a year older than Mpabbe and also a striker, I honestly can't think of any other striker in that age range and Mpabbe is clearly ahead of his class.

back to rumors.

Lots of rumblings that we might get Cucurela back from his spell at Elche and keep him as Albas backup. Makes allot of sense to me; better than spending on old ass Felipe Luis or Nacho Monreal, or getting insanely wack Alberto Moreno.

Talks that we will send 2, possibly 3 players on loan to Ajax, in the form of Puig, Oriol Busquets, Cuenca, Tobido and other names have popped up as possibles. Allot depending on if the B team gets promoted or not.

Also sounds like the club is considering off loading Umtiti and getting De Lit. They must seriously not trust Umtitis knee injury progress and what it means for his future/plus Lenglet is performing better than expected.

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Post by windkick on Wed Apr 17, 2019 5:07 pm

Umtiti hasn't trained with the team today, as the pain in his knee has come back to haunt him. [TV3]

According to the rumors, Umtiti will be sold and deLit will be brought in during the summer. The clubs not happy with his refusal to get surgery all season/plus don't trust the injury in the long run as its the same one that forced Puyol to retire.

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Post by alexjanosik on Sat May 04, 2019 7:01 pm

Rumors that Griezman is confirmed. Foolhardy signing if true. He is not an elite player and occupies the same positions as Messi. He can never replace Suarez. A two up top of Messi and Griezman will be disastrous. On top of it, he is relatively old, expensive and will demand high wages.
Would much rather persist with Suarez one more season and see if we cant entice Mbappe or maybe someone new breaks out.

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Post by Myesyats on Sat May 04, 2019 10:47 pm

Lol we are such cucks if Griezmann joins now after rejecting and disrespecting us. I'll be fucking livid.
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Post by windkick on Thu May 09, 2019 7:41 pm

Sport claims as many as 8 guys could get the ax.

Only names mentioned to possibly come in are Grizeman and De Ligt

Names mentioned to leave

Out of contract and won't be renewed/purchased option won't be excercised
Thomas Vermaelen
Douglas
Kevin Prince Boateng
Jeison Murillo

More than likely will be out
Rafinha
Denis Suarez
Andre Gomes
Adrian Ortola
Coutinho
Jasper Cillessen

Rumored to be out if a good offer arrives
Malcom
Samuel Umtiti
Rakitic

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Post by BarrileteCosmico on Thu May 09, 2019 8:23 pm

Sport is never reliable though, especially for these generic articles.

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Post by BarrileteCosmico on Thu May 09, 2019 8:25 pm

Allegri is apparently available and we are going for Koeman Laughing

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Post by windkick on Thu May 09, 2019 9:05 pm

yeah just posting rumors. rumors are rumors after all

yeah apparently Allegri is leaving Juve and Conte will replace him. Xavi is available but i don't trust him yet to be ready nor has his name been thrown around. The Ajax coach's name and Betis's coach are the 2 other names mentioned

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Post by alexjanosik on Fri May 10, 2019 12:27 am

Allegri, Koeman, Setien :facepalm:
I like Ten Hag based on what I have seen in the CL but he wont solve the structural issues we have.

On players, I am still not sure about MDL. Pros are he is technically good, phenominal in the air, physically well built and is a good leader. Major con is pace. He is slow and we seriously need an injection of pace and athleticism especially if Busquets and Scruberto continue to start.
I would rather we roll the dice with Todibo who looks very promising. Give him 15, 20 games next season. If he clicks, we save the MDL money.

Would much rather spend the MDL money elsewhere. We need a mobile striker But I see no capable Suarez replacement barring Mbappe, who is unattainable. Spend the money on a fast athletic CM/DM. Or save for the next superstar.

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Post by BarrileteCosmico on Fri May 10, 2019 2:12 am

Thoughts on the griezeman rumors resurfacing?

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