Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?

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Post by VivaStPauli on Sun Oct 20, 2019 1:48 pm

Well, the "minor changes" are quite bad for the UK, so really looking forward to see how Johnson will try and spin this. I mean he'll probably just outright lie, and because that will cause confusion people will be "unsure what to believe", at which point he'll use the chaos to just squirrel away and try something new.
Just look at unique, poor fella can't even coherently state what he himself believes, or what he thinks Johnson believes. Right-wing populism is basically macro-psychological wizardry by now, people just can't follow what's going on so they end up just agreeing with the people feeding them the most agreeable trigger words.

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Post by Unique on Sun Oct 20, 2019 2:10 pm

@VivaStPauli wrote:Well, the "minor changes" are quite bad for the UK, so really looking forward to see how Johnson will try and spin this. I mean he'll probably just outright lie, and because that will cause confusion people will be "unsure what to believe", at which point he'll use the chaos to just squirrel away and try something new.
Just look at unique, poor fella can't even coherently state what he himself believes, or what he thinks Johnson believes. Right-wing populism is basically macro-psychological wizardry by now, people just can't follow what's going on so they end up just agreeing with the people feeding them the most agreeable trigger words.
its not like angela merkel didnt lie and cover up all the crimes that got commited by her open door policy.

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Post by VivaStPauli on Sun Oct 20, 2019 2:27 pm

@Unique wrote:its not like angela merkel didnt lie and cover up all the crimes that got commited by her open door policy.


You keep saying things like that, and stopping to reply when people ask for any kind of evidence for it. Like now:
Do you have any kind of evidence for that?

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Post by futbol_bill on Sun Oct 20, 2019 2:30 pm

@Unique, spoken like a true populist, deflection!! When you can’t answer the question, deflect, attack, spill out BS and change subject.

Apparently Boris has sent the letter to request extent, in a very bizarre format saying he is obligated to do so and then he tells them they shouldn’t grant the extension!
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Post by Unique on Sun Oct 20, 2019 2:40 pm

@VivaStPauli wrote:
@Unique wrote:its not like angela merkel didnt lie and cover up all the crimes that got commited by her open door policy.


You keep saying things like that, and stopping to reply when people ask for any kind of evidence for it. Like now:
Do you have any kind of evidence for that?
mate i can have a discussion with anybody about anything. i can accept everyone has an opinion on anything but you live with your head up your ass. police in europe have been told to cover up crimes comitted by refugees. police in germany and scandinavia have come out and told people that governments have told them to cover up the crimes and you refuse to believe it. i have never in my 45years of life met a person that i disagree more with than you. you ask people to prove there point and when they do you just say its all lies and you never prove any of your points.

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Post by Unique on Sun Oct 20, 2019 2:48 pm

@futbol_bill wrote:@Unique, spoken like a true populist, deflection!! When you can’t answer the question, deflect, attack, spill out BS and change subject.

Apparently Boris has sent the letter to request extent, in a very bizarre format saying he is obligated to do so and then he tells them they shouldn’t grant the extension!
has catalonia taken over spain yet billy boy. i see in the news they are making a good fight of it. :coffee:

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Post by Unique on Sun Oct 20, 2019 2:55 pm

im sure we had this discussion before and i think it was thimmy who had a friend or knew a police officer or something like that and the guy told him from his own mouth that the police are told by government to lie and cover up crimes by refugees and because viva never had a good excuse for the people doing the crimes he just said the policeman was lieing and he dont beleave it. how can you talk to a guy like that when he just says i think its all lies when you give him some facts. the guy lives with the fairys tbh.

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Post by BarrileteCosmico on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:05 pm

@RealGunner wrote:You do know that Corbyn is pro-leave right lol?

this lol. Corbyn had been dragged kicking and screaming into supporting a 2nd ref he very clearly does not want.

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Post by VivaStPauli on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:05 pm

@Unique wrote:im sure we had this discussion before and i think it was thimmy who had a friend or knew a police officer or something like that and the guy told him from his own mouth that the police are told by government to lie and cover up crimes by refugees and because viva never had a good excuse for the people doing the crimes he just said the policeman was lieing and he dont beleave it. how can you talk to a guy like that when he just says i think its all lies when you give him some facts. the guy lives with the fairys tbh.


Because I'm an actual scientist with a university degree and don't just believe something if "a friend of a friend" told it, because shit like that is how people believe they eat spiders in their sleep and that pop rocks can kill you. It's conspiracy theories, if you want to convince me you need some hard evidence. And I'm not impossible to convince, I did believe Edward Snowden, and I did believe the material leaked on WikiLeaks regarding the DNC, or the Panama Papers.
If all you got is a mate's cousin's auntie who once heard it said in a pub, or a fucking Breitbard OpEd, I'm not going to believe you. If you find a whistleblower actually producing some documents, or multiple first-hand witnesses for something I will come around.
But something a cop supposedly told a friend of a friend?
Mate, the cops here get caught with Nazi memorabilia in their cupboards every day that ends in "Y", I'm not just gonna believe shit they make up.

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Post by VivaStPauli on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:07 pm

PS: Well technically I'm not a scientist, I got a degree the needed master's degree, but I don't work in my field. Or any scientific field. I did read my Carl Popper, though, which was my point.


Last edited by VivaStPauli on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:08 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by futbol_bill on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:08 pm

My grandfather heard a tale from a friend who heard it from his cousin who heard it from her sister who had read it in a fake news outlet from Russia!
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Post by VivaStPauli on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:08 pm

@futbol_bill wrote:My grandfather heard a tale from a friend who heard it from his cousin who heard it from her sister who had read it in a fake news outlet from Russia!

That's my point, yes.

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Post by Unique on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:13 pm

@VivaStPauli wrote:
@Unique wrote:im sure we had this discussion before and i think it was thimmy who had a friend or knew a police officer or something like that and the guy told him from his own mouth that the police are told by government to lie and cover up crimes by refugees and because viva never had a good excuse for the people doing the crimes he just said the policeman was lieing and he dont beleave it. how can you talk to a guy like that when he just says i think its all lies when you give him some facts. the guy lives with the fairys tbh.


Because I'm an actual scientist with a university degree and don't just believe something if "a friend of a friend" told it, because shit like that is how people believe they eat spiders in their sleep and that pop rocks can kill you. It's conspiracy theories, if you want to convince me you need some hard evidence. And I'm not impossible to convince, I did believe Edward Snowden, and I did believe the material leaked on WikiLeaks regarding the DNC, or the Panama Papers.
If all you got is a mate's cousin's auntie who once heard it said in a pub, or a fucking Breitbard OpEd, I'm not going to believe you. If you find a whistleblower actually producing some documents, or multiple first-hand witnesses for something I will come around.
But something a cop supposedly told a friend of a friend?
Mate, the cops here get caught with Nazi memorabilia in their cupboards every day that ends in "Y", I'm not just gonna believe shit they make up.
so merkel dont tell lies becuase you are a scientist. you are a joke tbh. rofl rofl

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Post by VivaStPauli on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:14 pm

You're, again, not getting my point.
Merkel probably lies all the time, she's a politician. And her party has basically been lying since the founding of our Republic, they're the fucking gold medalists in lying.
I'm saying a mate of a mate telling you someone's lying is not proof. Even you might get this at some point.

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Post by VivaStPauli on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:17 pm

Also I can't prove Merkel is not lying because you can't prove a negative, which is why I mentioned I went to university, because you learn this shit in your first semester. Not meaning you don't learn it anywhere else, but you cannot become a scientist without learning how logic works. And you're not very good at logic.

Again:
I am not saying whether Merkel is lying or not.
I am, however, saying that you don't have any proof she's lying, because hearsay from a mate of a mate of someone you met on the internet is not proof.

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Post by Unique on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:25 pm

@VivaStPauli wrote:Also I can't prove Merkel is not lying because you can't prove a  negative, which is why I mentioned I went to university, because you learn this shit in your first semester. Not meaning you don't learn it anywhere else, but you cannot become a scientist without learning how logic works. And you're not very good at logic.

Again:
I am not saying whether Merkel is lying or not.
I am, however, saying that you don't have any proof she's lying, because hearsay from a mate of a mate of someone you met on the internet is not proof.
i didnt say it was a mate of a mate. i said ( and you can find the reports on line ) that police were told by governments to lie. then i said i think it was thimmy ( it might not have been him and sorry if im wrong ) said a policeman told him to his face that that is a fact and you just said i dont believe any of them. and imo you dont believe them because you dont want to believe them.


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Post by VivaStPauli on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:27 pm

I haven't found the reports online, though, which is my exact point.

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Post by VivaStPauli on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:28 pm

And by the way, this entire discussion is me doing you the favor of engaging in your Whataboutism considering Angela Merkel - we were actually talking about Boris Johnson lying his ass off (which isn't hearsay, I actually mean his transcribed and televised statements from last week are not in sync with the ones from this week, especially the ones after he asked for another extension).

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Post by futbol_bill on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:35 pm

What is a poliveman?
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Post by Unique on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:36 pm

@VivaStPauli wrote:And by the way, this entire discussion is me doing you the favor of engaging in your Whataboutism considering Angela Merkel - we were actually talking about Boris Johnson lying his ass off (which isn't hearsay, I actually mean his transcribed and televised statements from last week are not in sync with the ones from this week, especially the ones after he asked for another extension).
sure boris is lying. they all lie except the ones you back.

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Post by Unique on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:38 pm

@futbol_bill wrote:What is a poliveman?
its a typo you geriatric old git Laughing

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Post by Unique on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:41 pm

@VivaStPauli wrote:I haven't found the reports online, though, which is my exact point.


https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/12090655/German-authorities-accused-of-migrant-attack-cover-up.html

hold up though. is the telegraph lying to me. Very Happy

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Post by Unique on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:44 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jan/11/swedish-police-accused-cover-up-sex-attacks-refugees-festival

more lies from the guardian.

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Post by Unique on Sun Oct 20, 2019 3:46 pm

anyway back on topic because this is going round and round. lets hope my man boris can get this done by the 31st

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Post by VivaStPauli on Sun Oct 20, 2019 4:21 pm

@Unique wrote:
@VivaStPauli wrote:I haven't found the reports online, though, which is my exact point.


https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/12090655/German-authorities-accused-of-migrant-attack-cover-up.html

hold up though. is the telegraph lying to me. Very Happy


The telegraf is literally quoting the Bild which is speaking of "accusations", no actual proof anywhere. I never denied there were accusations. You're accusing people right now of a coverup. Doesn't mean that you're right, or have proof.

Obviously I'm less informed about Sweden than Germany, but I've read the Guardian article you linked, and from what I can see, even in that article there was no mention of any evidence of coverup, just some shitty decision-making by local police and festival organizers, the letter of whom aren't part of a nefarious plot to turn all of your neighbours into brown people, they're just a couple of blokes who don't want bad PR around their festival because they would very much enjoy making more of that money they've heard so much about.

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Post by Unique on Sun Oct 20, 2019 8:00 pm

@VivaStPauli wrote:
@Unique wrote:
@VivaStPauli wrote:I haven't found the reports online, though, which is my exact point.


https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/12090655/German-authorities-accused-of-migrant-attack-cover-up.html

hold up though. is the telegraph lying to me. Very Happy


The telegraf is literally quoting the Bild which is speaking of "accusations", no actual proof anywhere. I never denied there were accusations. You're accusing people right now of a coverup. Doesn't mean that you're right, or have proof.

Obviously I'm less informed about Sweden than Germany, but I've read the Guardian article you linked, and from what I can see, even in that article there was no mention of any evidence of coverup, just some shitty decision-making by local police and festival organizers, the letter of whom aren't part of a nefarious plot to turn all of your neighbours into brown people, they're just a couple of blokes who don't want bad PR around their festival because they would very much enjoy making more of that money they've heard so much about.
im not worried about my neighbours we police our own cul-de-sac and we pick what neighbours can stay and what ones have to leave. but my point still stands. the politicians you back lie to you just as much as the politicians i back lie to me. and they all cover their own ass with lies and if you dont agree with that you are not worth debating with tbh.

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