Brexit: Should the UK stay or go?

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Post by Hapless_Hans on Wed Jan 16, 2019 6:14 pm

Special shout out to Stella Creasy who's speaking now and easily delivered the best speech I've seen so far

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Post by Hapless_Hans on Wed Jan 16, 2019 6:22 pm

this one douche just credited Thatcher with the end of socialism and the fall of the Berlin Wall

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Post by RealGunner on Wed Jan 16, 2019 6:50 pm

We are back again.

Historic moment

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Post by Hapless_Hans on Wed Jan 16, 2019 7:02 pm

Surely May will win this

they're making this about Corbyn and I don't see how the Conservatives can vote against May in that light?

The bespectacled manbaby that is apparently environment secretary made the logical argument that since Corbyn does not want to "fight fascism" in Syria and won't "stand up to Putin", he can't negotiate a better deal wit the EU

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Post by Hapless_Hans on Wed Jan 16, 2019 7:10 pm

that speaker guy is just bizarre rofl

decision imminent...

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Post by Hapless_Hans on Wed Jan 16, 2019 7:17 pm

Parliament voted no on the no confidence vote

so May won it

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Post by RealGunner on Wed Jan 16, 2019 7:30 pm

By 19 votes...

If DUP weren't so corrupt, May would and should have lost
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Post by Art Morte on Wed Jan 16, 2019 8:15 pm

Time for Corbyn to either work with May to devise a Brexit deal that Labour will vote for - or back a 2nd referendum, for which there's a lot of demand among Labour MPs and voters. Continuing to sit on the fence in the hope of a general election does no good any longer.
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Post by Hapless_Hans on Wed Jan 16, 2019 8:34 pm

Did I hear that right and did they just give money to the Unionist Northern Ireland districts in exchange for those votes Laughing

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Post by RealGunner on Wed Jan 16, 2019 8:39 pm

@Hapless_Hans wrote:Did I hear that right and did they just give money to the Unionist Northern Ireland districts in exchange for those votes Laughing


yes

taxpayers money

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Post by CBarca on Wed Jan 16, 2019 8:45 pm

So what's the significance here? May is still in power vs Corbyn yes, but at the end of the day both said they would look for a Brexit deal correct?

Obviously there are politics beyond Brexit where May vs Corbyn is a difference, but I imagine that the only real thing getting done in Parliament/Downing Street right now (especially given the time constraints at this point) is Brexit anyway, so until Brexit is dealt with, other domestic policies are rather unimportant. I could be wrong on that and correct me if I am.

Is it that Corbyn would have sought out a tremendously different deal than the one May is looking for?

I'm only minimally engaged in UK politics so feel free to correct me at any point

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Post by Art Morte on Wed Jan 16, 2019 8:51 pm

@CBarca wrote:So what's the significance here? May is still in power vs Corbyn yes, but at the end of the day both said they would look for a Brexit deal correct?

Obviously there are politics beyond Brexit where May vs Corbyn is a difference, but I imagine that the only real thing getting done in Parliament/Downing Street right now (especially given the time constraints at this point) is Brexit anyway, so until Brexit is dealt with, other domestic policies are rather unimportant. I could be wrong on that and correct me if I am.

Is it that Corbyn would have sought out a tremendously different deal than the one May is looking for?

I'm only minimally engaged in UK politics so feel free to correct me at any point


No, May's deal is, in my opinion, a more Labour-like deal than Tory-like. That's why 118 Tories voted against it, too. Corbyn has just been hell bent on voting against anything the Tories suggest, hope that the Tories fail, the government falls and there's a new election, which Labour might win. But tonight the "government falls" part was put to test and it didn't happen. Corbyn is frustrating a lot of Labour supporters by his continual refusal to commit either way, whether it's pursuing Brexit or 2nd referendum. He's put his ambition of becoming Prime Minister ahead of successful Brexit.
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Post by BarrileteCosmico on Wed Jan 16, 2019 8:58 pm

So now on Monday May will present her new proposal, right? If the Tory party gets behind it they go back to the EU. Who are likely to send them straight back as nothing will have really changed. So we are still facing No Deal or Remain and a game of chicken.

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Post by Unique on Thu Jan 17, 2019 11:08 pm

sadiq khan the mayor of london talking too much about a brexit deal. maybe he should be trying to sort out the record number of stabbings and gang violence thats going on in london. the guy is a waste of space at his own job and he thinks he knows best about other peoples jobs.

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Post by Hapless_Hans on Mon Jan 21, 2019 4:30 pm

Finding myself watching a UK parliamentary debate again

this house of commons is growing on me

as is John Bercow

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Post by Hapless_Hans on Mon Jan 21, 2019 4:35 pm

I should have found a spot in my top 20 for Jo Swinson somewhere but it's a tough contest

I might be developing a fetish here, and you might be witnessing it

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Post by Hapless_Hans on Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:11 pm

can't believe they're not working towards extending the negotiation period
May seems to want to pressure the house (i.e. her party MPs) into supporting her deal by insisting on the March deadline, but in the face of the monumental defeat she got last week that seems ludicrus and hurtfully stubborn

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Post by Lucifer on Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:26 pm

@Hapless_Hans wrote:I should have found a spot in my top 20 for Jo Swinson somewhere but it's a tough contest

I might be developing a fetish here, and you might be witnessing it

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Post by Hapless_Hans on Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:39 pm

Wow, the Scots are understandably seething and it would only be right if they moved towards independence now

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Post by Art Morte on Mon Jan 21, 2019 6:41 pm

May seems to be all out of ideas.

Have Parliament vote between Nay Deal, May Deal and Remain and just go with whatever gets the most votes.
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Post by rincon on Mon Jan 21, 2019 6:44 pm

If the deadline wont be postponed. That's what makes the most sense.

Time is up, vote on it and see.
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Post by BarrileteCosmico on Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:33 pm

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/europe-says-no-to-theresa-mays-brexit-plan-b-a4044431.html

May takes same request to Brusells, gets soundly rejected again

The only chance the May deal has is a Labour revolt. Both parties should be ashamed of themselves for putting party over country.

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Post by BarrileteCosmico on Wed Jan 30, 2019 2:38 am

MPs rejected No Deal today. A week ago they rejected the May Deal. The EU rejected renegotiating for a New Deal. So does that mean that by process of elimination the only option remaining is Remain? What else is there?

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Post by Art Morte on Wed Jan 30, 2019 2:08 pm

If Brexit isn't postponed, they probably have to choose between those three options. This latest development, where May is supposed to go to Brussels and say "let's ditch the backstop and do something else instead", is just delusional.
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Post by BarrileteCosmico on Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:42 pm

Those are the 3 options for months now. Don't even see how it would get postponed, what's the point? EU won't renegotiate, so what could be achieved from a postponement other than extending this period of uncertainty and malaise. Also can the UK unilaterally postpone or would the EU have to accept it?

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Post by Art Morte on Wed Jan 30, 2019 4:12 pm

EU would have to accept and the UK would need to provide some valid reasons. But if the UK said something like "we need time to arrange a 2nd referendum" I think the EU would accept. Doesn't look like the UK is going to ask postponement just to negotiate more.

Of course you cannot trust online comments, but what's interesting is that on every BBC article on Brexit where comments are just available, it's pro no-deal comments that consistently get the most upvotes. I get that on sites like the Daily Mail that is the case, but the BBC is as neutral as it gets in the UK.
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